Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Your favorite books and links
prognastat
Posts: 991
Joined: Fri May 04, 2018 8:30 pm
Location: Texas
Contact:

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by prognastat »

Well considering she thinks it's normal to pay someone 350k in a year to help take care of your mom...

Yeah that's something the median household is going to be able to afford. If you think that's normal it's quite clear you have lost touch with what is normal for the vast majority of your fellow citizens.

Tyler9000
Posts: 1758
Joined: Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:45 pm

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by Tyler9000 »

jacob wrote:
Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:31 pm
Once you have many million dollars, it'll easily cost you 4-5 figures to pay for someone to swing a hammer for you.
You nailed it. (pun very much intended)

An enterprising playwright could easily write a nice script for "The Mexican Fisherman" casting SO as the businessman.

RealPerson
Posts: 875
Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:33 pm

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by RealPerson »

She starts out by saying the jobs will disappear due to AI and then argues that we need to keep working at those non-existing jobs to save 10 to 100 million. Apparently the contradiction was lost on her. And making the point that you need to save 100 million is silly when you know the average retirement savings in the US. Living on a private island is not good for her perspective.

Suze made the case for FIRE without even realizing it, because she clearly doesn't understand the concept. Maybe Jacob can send her a copy of his book.

EdithKeeler
Posts: 1099
Joined: Sun Sep 01, 2013 7:55 pm

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by EdithKeeler »

Discussion right now on the Retirement Investing forum at the Motley Fool. “$5 M is a reasonable savings goal.” Pfft.

Stahlmann
Posts: 1121
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2016 6:05 pm

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by Stahlmann »

Mister Imperceptible wrote:
Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:59 am
“Typical leftist beta cuck”

(jk lol)
If 1% takes 60% of the pie and you aren't part of said 1%, but support system which propagates such atrocities... who is real cuck?

(no kidding)

User avatar
jennypenny
Posts: 6851
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:20 pm

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by jennypenny »


CS
Posts: 709
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2012 10:24 pm

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by CS »

Optimal_Solution wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 9:46 pm
I was hoping for more maturity from this crowd.
Thanks for speaking up. I often wonder if some here even realize how misogynistic they are. Getting a laugh doesn't mean you aren't being a M.P.. Women don't exist solely to be judged for not being in every way the perfect male sex toy, nor do they exist to be the victims in some "clever" (taste the sarcasm) flash fiction.

jacob
Site Admin
Posts: 15907
Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:38 pm
Location: USA, Zone 5b, Koppen Dfa, Elev. 620ft, Walkscore 77
Contact:

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by jacob »

I cleaned up a bunch of stuff above.

Remember, it's always possible to hit the "!" button. This ensures I will see the issue as soon as I log on.
I do not continuously monitor all threads and I also sometimes sleep or step away from the computer even if it's hard to believe.

Dream of Freedom
Posts: 753
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:58 pm
Location: Nebraska, US

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by Dream of Freedom »

Yes it was getting awfully vulgar.

Nomad
Posts: 389
Joined: Wed May 16, 2018 5:23 pm
Location: UK

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by Nomad »

So the problem with early retirement is not having universal healthcare?

chicago81
Posts: 307
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2012 3:24 pm
Location: Chicago, IL

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by chicago81 »

I listened to the whole interview podcast, and the whole follow-up podcast.

I'm sure Suze has helped a whole lot of "financially illiterate" folks in the past.

That being said...

What I heard from her in that interview was pretty ridiculous. Her entire argument against FIRE seemed to revolve around "black swan" events that can ruin your life. These same "black swan" events are the things that dominate FIRE discussion boards with obsessive analysis, spreadsheets, charts, software simulations, etc.

The audience for Suze's TV shows and books is clearly not the same as the FIRE audience. She should have known this going into the interview. Otherwise, she wouldn't have made herself sound so ridiculous.

Dream of Freedom
Posts: 753
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:58 pm
Location: Nebraska, US

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by Dream of Freedom »

I ran into this on seekingalpha

https://seekingalpha.com/article/421098 ... e-movement

"The problem with Ms. Orman's argument is she's only looking at one side of the equation - the financial cost of retirement. For the sake of logical consistency, she ought to be looking at BOTH sides of the work/ retirement equation. What about the financial costs of working and earning money?"

User avatar
jennypenny
Posts: 6851
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:20 pm

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by jennypenny »


jacob
Site Admin
Posts: 15907
Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:38 pm
Location: USA, Zone 5b, Koppen Dfa, Elev. 620ft, Walkscore 77
Contact:

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by jacob »


Earlybath
Posts: 43
Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2016 8:43 am

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by Earlybath »

She says she was working from "bad information".
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_ ... 2681919550

prognastat
Posts: 991
Joined: Fri May 04, 2018 8:30 pm
Location: Texas
Contact:

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by prognastat »

I mean I think she was wrong when at first thinking everyone in FIRE just wanted to sit sipping margaritas on a beach was wrong, but I also don't think everyone in the FIRE movement wants to pursue other forms of income after either.

Also it still fails to address that someone who for example retires early, but makes an income from investments similar to that which most american's make is in effect no worse off than those making that income fromW-2 income(better yet they have a bunch of time on top of that which is also worth something).

I suspect she wanted to make a slightly controversial statement for PR reasons to help her comeback and it backfired as the backlash was stronger and more coherent than expected.

User avatar
jennypenny
Posts: 6851
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:20 pm

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by jennypenny »

Another article on Market Watch,
this time defending FIRE.


One comment jumped out at me ... "Saving early and often is very important, but retiring early robs the rest of us of your contributions." I think it foretells a shifting attitude towards early retirees. It will only get worse as Social Security runs out of money.

User avatar
Sclass
Posts: 2791
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:15 pm
Location: Orange County, CA

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by Sclass »

jennypenny wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 5:28 pm
Another article on Market Watch,
this time defending FIRE.


One comment jumped out at me ... "Saving early and often is very important, but retiring early robs the rest of us of your contributions." I think it foretells a shifting attitude towards early retirees. It will only get worse as Social Security runs out of money.
Better ER now then. :lol:

tonyedgecombe
Posts: 450
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2012 2:11 pm
Location: Oxford, UK Walkscore: 3

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by tonyedgecombe »

but retiring early robs the rest of us of your contributions.
Wow, I'm not sure what to make of that attitude.

User avatar
Seppia
Posts: 2016
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:34 am
Location: South Florida

Re: Suze Orman Hates FIRE

Post by Seppia »

It’s certainly a factually correct observation.
Also a factually correct observation: our parents generation (let’s say for simplicity “the boomers”) is mortgaging our future to preserve outdated and unjustified privileges (see: incoming pension crisis).

I don’t think “avoiding to contribute more” is worse than “taking out more than what was contributed”.

In the aggregate, the math would suggest gen X and Millennials will have to cover the gaps left by the boomers (= contribute more than we will take out as a result of them taking out more than they contributed) , so while I adore my parents and feel that in many ways they were better than us, I would certainly not feel guilty pulling the plug.

Post Reply