Using ERE for other purposes ?

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Colibri
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Location: Northern Canada

Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by Colibri » Tue Jan 02, 2018 9:38 pm

Hello all,

I am new on the forum, I have been lurking on the forum for quite a bit, maybe for the last 2 years or more ? I discovered ERE when I was looking at options to stop working or at least reduce greatly the amount of time I spent working. I entered the canadian job market in my early twenties, it was all great the first 3-4 years but I eventually realized this was not for me, the whole 9-5 schedule, office politics, daily non-sense, interacting with people I dislike...etc.
I am now in my early thirties and do freelance work, I am working on average 5-10 hours a week and love it. I can do it financially too despite living in a place where living cost are pretty high (northern Canada)

That leads me to think/inquire if anybody here used ERE to not necessarily retired but to simply reduce working hours or other purposes ?

Cheers !

slowtraveler
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Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by slowtraveler » Tue Jan 02, 2018 10:52 pm

Jacob has said ERE was a poor choice of words before. Financial Independence is more on point.

The whole point is to have freedom to do what you want. Working less hours can be more satisfying than not working at all for some. If that's you, awesome. Even those of us that retire often end up doing something that ends up making money besides capital management.

You can call it semi-retired, consulting, working part time, whatever. It is a flexible system for a reason.

I haven't ERE yet but I have had some level of assets allow me to move abroad and negotiate working from my computer so Im much happier now.

OTCW
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Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by OTCW » Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:06 pm

I work about half time. Quit the full time grind a little over 3 years ago. ERE definitely helped me do that.

Farm_or
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Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by Farm_or » Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:09 am

My lurking over the years helped me work out of my time clock job and into small business. You can be creative about employing concepts here.

I believe it gives me an edge over most of my competition, so I can profit more from lower price. Many of my techniques would be deemed extreme by the mainstream. The examples portrayed here remove any mental obstacles that I might otherwise have to trying radically different ideas.

BeyondtheWrap
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Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by BeyondtheWrap » Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:55 pm

The basic idea of ERE is that by reducing your consumption you reduce the amount you work. If you spend 25% of your income, you only have to work 25% as much as someone who spends 100%.

Most followers of ERE do this by having a shorter career, around 5-10 years (about 25% of a full career length), but their work week is still a normal length for those years. You are doing the opposite approach which is to work 25% of the hours each week but have a normally long career. In both approaches you work the same total amount of time over the course of your life.

daylen
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Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by daylen » Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:09 pm

BeyondtheWrap wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:55 pm
In both approaches you work the same total amount of time over the course of your life.
It is more efficient to make more early due to compound interest. Though this doesn't mean that it is the best option for everyone.

phil
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Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by phil » Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:55 pm

daylen wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:09 pm
It is more efficient to make more early due to compound interest. Though this doesn't mean that it is the best option for everyone.
On the other hand, when working less hours per week the tax rate is lower (at least in my country this makes a big difference). I agree that both are valid options depending on specific circumstances, personality etc. I wonder, however, for how many people the working 25% option is possible in practice. Imagine asking your employer if you can work only 10 hours a week :).

Tyler9000
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Location: Austin, TX

Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by Tyler9000 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:38 pm

When I hit FI I took a full year off of work, did a full year of project-based consulting, and eventually decided that a consistent 3 days a week without any notable management responsibilities was the best balance of leisure and profitable intellectual stimulation. I reserve the right to change my mind again, but that freedom is the beauty of FI.

Lately I've been thinking about using ERE coupled with my new work gig to partially disable my ingrained savers mindset and live a little. Now that retirement is covered and maximizing savings is no longer a primary concern, I can instead use my PT work income to live "paycheck to paycheck" in a cool, walkable, but expensive part of town I wouldn't have previously considered when I was thinking of retirement finance as a closed system. I'll still have FIRE-level investments backing me up and continuing to grow in the background, but an outside observer will just see a surprisingly happy and relaxed guy casually working 3 days a week to barely cover expenses. New adventures enabled by stealth wealth.

classical_Liberal
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Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by classical_Liberal » Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:14 pm

phil wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:55 pm
On the other hand, when working less hours per week the tax rate is lower (at least in my country this makes a big difference).
Second this point. Not to mention other opportunities which open up in a society that bases ideas of wealth mainly on earned income.
Tyler9000 wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:38 pm
but an outside observer will just see a surprisingly happy and relaxed guy casually working 3 days a week to barely cover expenses.
Tyler9000-The wage poor, latee-sucking, urban hipster, barely getting by in today's gig economy... Sounds like a mainstream news article?

Tyler9000
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Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by Tyler9000 » Thu Jan 04, 2018 12:11 am

classical_Liberal wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:14 pm
Tyler9000-The wage poor, latee-sucking, urban hipster, barely getting by in today's gig economy... Sounds like a mainstream news article?
That would be funny. I'd totally play it cool while slowly ramping up the ERE references.

"Yeah, living on a part time salary can be a challenge. I think being a minimalist has helped me make it work."

"Knowing how to cook inexpensively really saves a lot of money. Thank goodness for lentils."

"I've learned a lot of new skills in my spare time like art, fixing stuff, and web design. And honestly being a Renaissance Man is pretty rewarding both emotionally and financially."

"I do my best to structure my goals in a way that they mutually reinforce each other. Kinda like a web. I read somewhere that it makes you more resilient, and I have to agree."

"Luckily it doesn't take an astrophysicist to learn how to effectively manage money. Although I'm sure that wouldn't hurt. Someone should write a book about that."

"After living minimally on just a few Jacobs for so long I bet there's a point where I could sustain this lifestyle with modest investments. Retiring extremely early certainly sounds appealing, and I'm sure other smart people have figured it out."

FBeyer
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Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by FBeyer » Thu Jan 04, 2018 4:22 am

I don't know a proper English word to translate listepik, but it would be the phrase I'd use to describe that approach.

I laughed, so thank you for that :D

Colibri
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Location: Northern Canada

Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by Colibri » Thu Jan 04, 2018 7:42 pm

So I see there are people out there working part-time and still pursuing FI. It is still something I consider doing and I am already walking on that path financially speaking, I have a paid house, no debt and live simply. But I enjoy the transition between the full-time grind like OTCW mentionned and being FI and not doing anything that most people consider work.

It is also a little bit easier to explain to friends/family that you are self-employed/freelance, of course they don't have to know that you only worked 6 hours last week and don't struggle financially. Tyler9000, I like your approch to FI and part-time work.

Colibri
Posts: 45
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Location: Northern Canada

Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by Colibri » Thu Jan 04, 2018 7:51 pm

classical_Liberal wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:14 pm
phil wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:55 pm
On the other hand, when working less hours per week the tax rate is lower (at least in my country this makes a big difference).
Second this point. Not to mention other opportunities which open up in a society that bases ideas of wealth mainly on earned income.
Tyler9000 wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:38 pm
but an outside observer will just see a surprisingly happy and relaxed guy casually working 3 days a week to barely cover expenses.
Tyler9000-The wage poor, latee-sucking, urban hipster, barely getting by in today's gig economy... Sounds like a mainstream news article?
Yes, other opportunities that otherwise would not be possible with full-time work. That happened to me when I finally got more time for myself and doing new things, like (un-paid) translation work for an NGO in Haiti, writing for local art/culture magazine, helping a friend with his new buisness. When your schedule open up, then you realize how much opportunities are out there.

finity
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Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by finity » Fri Jan 05, 2018 2:37 am

You can also combine the approaches. Frontload saving a significant, not-yet FI amount and switch to other ventures in the following years. Jacob describes it in one of my favorite articles:

http://earlyretirementextreme.com/stran ... -land.html

wolf
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Re: Using ERE for other purposes ?

Post by wolf » Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:49 am

Colibri, what do you value most in your life? Maybe your current flexibility? Or do you need/want to have FI money to feel mentally secure? I guess some things depend on your level of risk awareness? Are you a long-term planer or do you do things without planing too much?
I have discoverd that I want to save extreme in the presence, in order to have many possibilities in the future, e.g. working abroad, part-time, ... I am more a long-term planer, who want to have things settled. I am risk averse. Therefore I think, that it depends a lot on our personality and your strength. There are many ways. It must fit you personally and you must feel good when you choose a way. What I also learned in the past years about ERE, FI, RE... that "it is not a destination, it is a way or a mindset". The journey is ongoing. You will reach milestones and there will be more new goals.

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