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spades
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:51 am

Hello everyone!

Post by spades » Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:41 am

My friend gave me the book when I finished uni a few months ago. Now that I got a job, I am eager to start saving money.
I want to save up to take some time off (few months) first of all, and in the long run I want to become financially independent by investing in property and production of wood or electricity or something similar. Not a big fan of stocks as it seems a bit like a fantasy product/pyramid scheme to me, but I know very little about investing so that could change. I also want to learn to live frugally so I can work less hours per week and still save money.
Living in Denmark with my girlfriend of a couple of years. We rented a massive apartment (before getting into early retirement), something I regret now.

My current goals are:

Maintain or decrease expenses from when I was a student. (about 7-10.000 DKR per month, 1000-1350 euros)
. Learn to eat cheaper. More staples, less meat.
- Learn to repair stuff
- Learn to buy things that last
- Not buy a car (using bike right now, but living only 6-7k from work)
Save up at least 120.000 DKR (about 16.000 euros) per year, increasing when my salary increases.
Take very few or no extra hours at work. I am forced to work 37/week which is okay, but I'd like a job where I could work when I needed money.
Take up repairing/refurbishing free stuff I find and selling it cheap. Hoping to make 500 DKR or so per month for a start. Have been doing a little of this, but giving it away as gifts to family and friends.
Producing some food myself. I don't have any land to grow anything on, so for now this consists of foraging for fruit and freezing it or fermenting it.
Maintain a good relationship with my girlfriend, who does not agree with all the attempts to save money, but is okay with it for now.

I want to do these things mainly for having a choice of what I want to do in case work becomes too tiresome (financial independence), but also for fun and to develop my personality, my discipline, knowledge and skills. And reducing environmental impact doesn't hurt either.

Today I heard about a town in Denmark where the municipality encouraging the people of the town to get a bunch of credit cards to start spending more to create more jobs. This triggered my first post here. Actually spending money so you can work is straight out of the bizarro world.

Looking for comments and good advice or a friendly hello :)

MDFIRE2024
Posts: 278
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2017 5:09 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Hello everyone!

Post by MDFIRE2024 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:47 pm

Hello spades. Welcome to the ERE forum. It all starts with the book...I guess. How did your friend find out about ERE in the first place?
How old are you? If you start your ERE journey right with your first job you could be lucky. You have so much time and you can learn so many things from other ERE persons. That could help you extremely to achieve your goals, together with your GF. Take care.

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FBeyer
Posts: 726
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 3:25 am

Re: Hello everyone!

Post by FBeyer » Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:15 pm

spades wrote:
Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:41 am
My friend gave me the book when I finished uni a few months ago....
Not a big fan of stocks as it seems a bit like a fantasy product/pyramid scheme to me
...I also want to learn to live frugally so I can work less hours per week and still save money.
...Maintain or decrease expenses from when I was a student. (about 7-10.000 DKR per month, 1000-1350 euros)
...Maintain a good relationship with my girlfriend, who does not agree with all the attempts to save money, but is okay with it for now.
Welcome. There's been a rather steady influx of Danes the last two years. We're having meetups every 3 months or so so there are plenty of opportunities to meet the peeps if you feel like it. However, ERE central is Copenhagen. In case you live in Aarhus I believe there are two or three other new-ish members, but I don't recall exactly.

You'll learn about stocks in due time. There are many ways to invest in stocks, the boring/efficient way involves very little pyramid scheming to be quite frank.

Learning to live frugally shouldn't be much of an issue. We've got carpenters, masons, accountants, investment bankers, lawyers, scientists, at least two financially independent real estate investors and at least one engineer on board the DK ERE train. The possible skill set you could need is well covered. The biggest issue if you ask me is your accomodation. Housing will make or break an easy escape. We found an astoundingly cheap house about a year and a half ago. The difference from now to before is 57000 per year on rent and heating alone. The hurdle is scalable when you don't own a normative amount of stuff; so get busy on the minimalism and you can live anywhere. Luckily we have at least two minimalists among the ERE'ers so we got you covered there as well.

My annual expenses last year were 61K so 7K to 10K per month is definitely doable. But... housing! Housing will KILL you annual expenditures.

You're probably not going to maintain a good relationship with your GF if all you do is talk about ERE. Just do ERE without any mentions and SHOW her, don't tell her, that you can get fine stuff and excellent food for very little money. A lot of people have never experienced the joy of creating or repairing anything themselves so there is a hurdle to cross there, too. Extreme savings are not about buying cheap stuff but buying amazing stuff at low prices, and then only buying what you really need.

Have fun and in case you're in Copenhagen: Join the next meetup on the 30th. We're gonna be jam packed with lots of new people and some interesting topics too!

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Eureka
Posts: 276
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2016 11:03 am
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark

Re: Hello everyone!

Post by Eureka » Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:08 am

Hi spades, a friendly hello from me.

I like your 'manifesto' and hope you will be able to keep focus and fulfill it. But what about working way more than full time for some years, save all you can, invest and create so much passive income that you don't need to work at all within a few years?

Can nothing be done about your huge apartment? Like rent out a room? Or move to a cheaper place? Eventually buy your own place as the value increase is tax free and thus could be another income stream?

Best luck from a fellow Dane

spades
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:51 am

Re: Hello everyone!

Post by spades » Wed Sep 27, 2017 5:38 am

Thanks for welcoming me everyone
MDFIRE2024 wrote:
Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:47 pm
How did your friend find out about ERE in the first place?
How old are you?
I'm 28. I think my friend read about Jacob online and decided to buy the book for himself and for me. I didn't know about before I got the book.
FBeyer wrote:
Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:15 pm
Welcome. There's been a rather steady influx of Danes the last two years. We're having meetups every 3 months or so so there are plenty of opportunities to meet the peeps if you feel like it. However, ERE central is Copenhagen. In case you live in Aarhus I believe there are two or three other new-ish members, but I don't recall exactly.

You'll learn about stocks in due time. There are many ways to invest in stocks, the boring/efficient way involves very little pyramid scheming to be quite frank.

Learning to live frugally shouldn't be much of an issue. We've got carpenters, masons, accountants, investment bankers, lawyers, scientists, at least two financially independent real estate investors and at least one engineer on board the DK ERE train. The possible skill set you could need is well covered. The biggest issue if you ask me is your accomodation. Housing will make or break an easy escape. We found an astoundingly cheap house about a year and a half ago. The difference from now to before is 57000 per year on rent and heating alone. The hurdle is scalable when you don't own a normative amount of stuff; so get busy on the minimalism and you can live anywhere. Luckily we have at least two minimalists among the ERE'ers so we got you covered there as well.

My annual expenses last year were 61K so 7K to 10K per month is definitely doable. But... housing! Housing will KILL you annual expenditures.

You're probably not going to maintain a good relationship with your GF if all you do is talk about ERE. Just do ERE without any mentions and SHOW her, don't tell her, that you can get fine stuff and excellent food for very little money. A lot of people have never experienced the joy of creating or repairing anything themselves so there is a hurdle to cross there, too. Extreme savings are not about buying cheap stuff but buying amazing stuff at low prices, and then only buying what you really need.

Have fun and in case you're in Copenhagen: Join the next meetup on the 30th. We're gonna be jam packed with lots of new people and some interesting topics too!
I'm based in Aarhus and I only go to Copenhagen maybe once a year. If I am going at a time of a meeting, i'll try to join you. How can I find out what time you meet?
I will probably read up on stocks when I have some more money to invest, right now I only have a few thousand.
My girlfriend and I rented a 4 bedroom apartment for just the two of us, all included it is around 8000 DKR per month, which is cheap for Aarhus but still a lot of money. I thought I would save a bit on working out at home by having an extra room, but it costs about 1000/month less for a 3 bedroom apartment versus a local gym membership of 250. I'm trying to sell some stuff I don't use anyway and I expect to move for work in a year or two. Then I will try to find a cheaper place to live.
My girlfriend has shifted from buying dinner plates etc at a fancy store to finding stuff in 2nd-hand stores and online - so she is catching on!
Eureka wrote:
Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:08 am
Hi spades, a friendly hello from me.

I like your 'manifesto' and hope you will be able to keep focus and fulfill it. But what about working way more than full time for some years, save all you can, invest and create so much passive income that you don't need to work at all within a few years?

Can nothing be done about your huge apartment? Like rent out a room? Or move to a cheaper place? Eventually buy your own place as the value increase is tax free and thus could be another income stream?

Best luck from a fellow Dane
I could take extra hours, but I really enjoy my time off and I have a hard time putting myself in a position I don't like (working all the time) for a benefit years away. I can't see myself saving 75% + so it will be quite a while before I am financially independent.
I spoke to my partner about renting out a room, but we can't agree on that. At some point I would like to own my home or rent out property, but I need to save up a lot of money first and I am worried about debt if the market value drops.

Thanks for the advice and comments everyone!

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FBeyer
Posts: 726
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 3:25 am

Re: Hello everyone!

Post by FBeyer » Wed Sep 27, 2017 12:21 pm

Don't read up on stocks now. Read up on decluttering and minimalism. Get to know your real needs first and pare down your possessions to match those needs. At that point your bills are decimated and you are ready to find a much, MUCH smaller apartment. Read the ERE book. Systems thinking is the solution to early retirement. The need to invest is a stop gap measure if you can't find other ways to meet your needs. :)

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