Hello from Romania
Posted: Sat Aug 29, 2015 7:45 pm
Hello everybody!
My name is Mirela and I am 39.
I first stumbled upon YMOYL about 5 or 6 years ago. It struck a deep chord and I could not stop thinking about it ever since. I have read it at least 4 times, every time promising myself to "follow the plan". BUT.... something always happened, and I failed. The worst part was tracking every penny. I never got further than that step.
I hope this time will be different. What I missed mostly was a community of like-minded people... a sort of "support group", and I hope to find it here.
Another issue I have with all the wonderful books and blogs out there on Financial independence or Early Retirement is that some of the situations don't apply to Romania. I have most trouble with the investing part for example, but other problems are equally daunting.
I hoped I'd find other Romanians here, but the only topic I found was this one viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1554&hilit=romania, and it looks like it hasn't been updated in a while, and possibly the OP no longer lives my "Romanian reality".
Speaking of that post, my view of the "ERE country" as Daniel put it, is quite different, although I understand his point of view.
Basically he said that most people in Romania already live the ERE lifestyle - frugality, sharing resources, not too much debt, accumulating life skills, a lot even owning their "shelter" - which means, as an ERE-er you'd look less "weird" around here. And to some degree this is true. The problem is that most people must do this in order to survive. It is not a means to gain financial independence. You live as frugally as possible in order to get to the next paycheck.
Daniel's view was a bit different because he happened to be among the lucky ones with a good job and a great paycheck. He worked in IT, so he could afford saving a good chunk of his monthly income.
If you're curious, here's a site that has some numbers related to the cost of living in Bucharest (where I work) http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/ci ... rrency=USD
The interesting thing is they list the average salary around 530 USD - which is true. Only it's true because in the big cities - but mostly in Bucharest - there are people who can earn a lot of money, working mainly in IT or for the multinational companies.
But, although that number of jobs is limited, it boosts the average salary. The truth is the vast majority of Romanians NEVER reach that "average" salary. Just two examples: a specialist doctor, after 12 years of medical school (6 in the University of Medicine and another 6 as resident in a hospital) earns 450 USD. And a teacher, at the end of his career, after more than 40 years of experience, with all the possible qualifications, reaches the "fabulous" amount of... 450 USD.
So... let's think about two teachers... they fall in love and get married . They're in their late 20's/ early 30's - so they probably make about 250 USD each. Average rent for a 1 br apartment (in a modest neighborhood!) would be exactly one of their salaries - 250. But they'd have to pay utilities as well, that can get as high as 100 USD (or more) in the winter months. Transport to the jobs? Groceries? Cable/Internet/Phone? Clothing? it all needs to fit in the 150 USD left - which is, most obviously, impossible! [mind you, I said nothing about eating out/ sports or other leisure/ professional books/ magazine subscriptions/ hobbies/ pets or vacations - these don't even cross their minds - they'd be too busy looking for the last penny in their pocket to buy a loaf of bread]
And that's why you'll actually find the "happy couple" living in - and sharing the costs and the 650 sq feet 2 br. matchbox apartment - with their own parents. And when the first child appears, the grandparents move to the living room, the young parents move to their parents' bedroom, and their old bedroom becomes the nursery. The sad thing is, that even in this "crazy" arrangement you can't save much (or at all).
BTW... I am a teacher. That's why I know this story all too well. (Not married to another teacher, although the average income of DH isn't much higher than mine). And our first child is on the way.
So.... here I laid my worries. Hope to find some support from you guys, especially if you live in an ex-communist country or somewhere with the same crazy cost of living vs actual income proportion. How do people in similar situations still make their way to FI? And how long does it actually take?
My name is Mirela and I am 39.
I first stumbled upon YMOYL about 5 or 6 years ago. It struck a deep chord and I could not stop thinking about it ever since. I have read it at least 4 times, every time promising myself to "follow the plan". BUT.... something always happened, and I failed. The worst part was tracking every penny. I never got further than that step.
I hope this time will be different. What I missed mostly was a community of like-minded people... a sort of "support group", and I hope to find it here.
Another issue I have with all the wonderful books and blogs out there on Financial independence or Early Retirement is that some of the situations don't apply to Romania. I have most trouble with the investing part for example, but other problems are equally daunting.
I hoped I'd find other Romanians here, but the only topic I found was this one viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1554&hilit=romania, and it looks like it hasn't been updated in a while, and possibly the OP no longer lives my "Romanian reality".
Speaking of that post, my view of the "ERE country" as Daniel put it, is quite different, although I understand his point of view.
Basically he said that most people in Romania already live the ERE lifestyle - frugality, sharing resources, not too much debt, accumulating life skills, a lot even owning their "shelter" - which means, as an ERE-er you'd look less "weird" around here. And to some degree this is true. The problem is that most people must do this in order to survive. It is not a means to gain financial independence. You live as frugally as possible in order to get to the next paycheck.
Daniel's view was a bit different because he happened to be among the lucky ones with a good job and a great paycheck. He worked in IT, so he could afford saving a good chunk of his monthly income.
If you're curious, here's a site that has some numbers related to the cost of living in Bucharest (where I work) http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/ci ... rrency=USD
The interesting thing is they list the average salary around 530 USD - which is true. Only it's true because in the big cities - but mostly in Bucharest - there are people who can earn a lot of money, working mainly in IT or for the multinational companies.
But, although that number of jobs is limited, it boosts the average salary. The truth is the vast majority of Romanians NEVER reach that "average" salary. Just two examples: a specialist doctor, after 12 years of medical school (6 in the University of Medicine and another 6 as resident in a hospital) earns 450 USD. And a teacher, at the end of his career, after more than 40 years of experience, with all the possible qualifications, reaches the "fabulous" amount of... 450 USD.
So... let's think about two teachers... they fall in love and get married . They're in their late 20's/ early 30's - so they probably make about 250 USD each. Average rent for a 1 br apartment (in a modest neighborhood!) would be exactly one of their salaries - 250. But they'd have to pay utilities as well, that can get as high as 100 USD (or more) in the winter months. Transport to the jobs? Groceries? Cable/Internet/Phone? Clothing? it all needs to fit in the 150 USD left - which is, most obviously, impossible! [mind you, I said nothing about eating out/ sports or other leisure/ professional books/ magazine subscriptions/ hobbies/ pets or vacations - these don't even cross their minds - they'd be too busy looking for the last penny in their pocket to buy a loaf of bread]
And that's why you'll actually find the "happy couple" living in - and sharing the costs and the 650 sq feet 2 br. matchbox apartment - with their own parents. And when the first child appears, the grandparents move to the living room, the young parents move to their parents' bedroom, and their old bedroom becomes the nursery. The sad thing is, that even in this "crazy" arrangement you can't save much (or at all).
BTW... I am a teacher. That's why I know this story all too well. (Not married to another teacher, although the average income of DH isn't much higher than mine). And our first child is on the way.
So.... here I laid my worries. Hope to find some support from you guys, especially if you live in an ex-communist country or somewhere with the same crazy cost of living vs actual income proportion. How do people in similar situations still make their way to FI? And how long does it actually take?