Early Retirement Super Extreme

[Spartan_Warrior]

ERE allows for retirement after x years spent in an accumulation phase. Are there lifestyle choices that allow one to more or less bypass the accumulation phase altogether, or live on way less capital than conventional ERE? Is it possible to completely eliminate/cover expenses simply through lifestyle choices, or live in a way that is "income positive" without ever working a conventional job?

[workathome]

Seduce and marry a rich partner? BOOM!

[theanimal]

I'm very interested in this topic.

I think there are a few paths one could take. One could go the moneyless route. Obtaining food from the wild and dumpsters, living rent free in a tent etc.

I have also heard of tiny house owners who exchange some manual labor (farm chores, helping around the house) for rent.

IMO the biggest hurdles are finding ways to fund/source food and housing.

[Ego]

Absolutely! Toss out an expense and we'll brainstorm ways to get it to zero.

We struggle to get our food bill (specifically fruit, veggies, nuts, seeds, tea, herbs...) and transport (one car in SoCal) to zero. I write off most of the car costs though. We could probably go to the food bank for free food but I just don't have the chutzpah.

[theanimal]

Another way would be homesteading, something like Helen and Scott Nearing. You would have all your food and only have to work a couple hours a day for a few months a year.
http://www.amazon.com/The-Good-Life-Nea ... 0805209700

[leeholsen]

if you pay attention to jacob's journal; you'll see he's doing this on about the best way possible living in the states.

imo, in the states; youre always going to have some expenses like housing/apartment, plumbing, electricity that'll only let you go so far down in expenses; the costs of living in a 1st world country.

if you really wanted to live on nothing, i watch stories on the 700 club all the time of people in 2nd and 3rd world countries making it on a few dollars a day; but in many cases they dont have electricity, showers; etc.

just depends what you want to live with.

[Seneca]

I think the most robust way to get there is off grid/permaculture.

Funny, this was just in the MSM today-

"When we built our first home, we had almost no money," Josie says. "We bought 20 acres of pristine desert land for $1,000 and moved an old bus onto it. The bus — retrofitted with a bed, small stove, solar panel and batteries, etc. — was our home until we could build a better quality one."

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/family-li ... VJQzFfMQ--

[vivacious]

ERE allows for retirement after x years spent in an accumulation phase. Are there lifestyle choices that allow one to more or less bypass the accumulation phase altogether, or live on way less capital than conventional ERE? Is it possible to completely eliminate/cover expenses simply through lifestyle choices, or live in a way that is "income positive" without ever working a conventional job?

The answer is, get a small piece of land. You can get decent pieces for only a few $1,000. Next you build a small cabin. This can be done for as little as $2,000 or so. You set everything up so it's sustainable, low impact as far as resources go, renewable, etc. Then you make a robust garden that can support 70-85% of your food. Can, store, dry, salt, cure, etc the food when ready.

Don't go too far from a city. Maybe 1-2 hours away. Then you can go into town when you need to. Try to locate near some resources also. You could probably do all of this for less than $10,000 and be instantly retired. From there you can do whatever hobby or small business you like. You could pick up an occasional small job if you need some cash. I haven't done this but I've read about it and thought about it and stuff.

[jacob]

@S_W - It depends on how you define retirement and especially how you define "working a conventional job". It doesn't take many hours of freelancing to pay for my way of life but such work might qualify as conventional jobbing. Homesteading can bring your costs all the way down to RE taxes + $0, but that's hardly effortless.

@leeholsen - I could spend less than I do now if DW didn't insist on some semblance of middle class appearance; things like a kitchen, propane, electricity, a couch, ... The cheaper way is to live in the desert, on the road, on the water, ... but you'll be heading in the direction of either homesteading or "homeless".

@general - One way would be to buy a truck (but you'd need some accumulation to actually buy it), live in it, and only drive when getting short on food. Or you could become a trapper/bushcrafter roaming state forests. Things like that. As always, the more you know, the less you need. I think in many cases, it's easier just to accumulate more money than squeeze the last 20% out of a regular budget. So I think the question needs to be specified more. What are your boundary conditions? There must be some. Otherwise I understand the prison system pays room and board and doesn't qualify as a job in the conventional sense

[Hexagon]

ERE allows for retirement after x years spent in an accumulation phase. Are there lifestyle choices that allow one to more or less bypass the accumulation phase altogether, or live on way less capital than conventional ERE? Is it possible to completely eliminate/cover expenses simply through lifestyle choices, or live in a way that is "income positive" without ever working a conventional job?

The answer is, get a small piece of land. You can get decent pieces for only a few $1,000. Next you build a small cabin. This can be done for as little as $2,000 or so. You set everything up so it's sustainable, low impact as far as resources go, renewable, etc. Then you make a robust garden that can support 70-85% of your food. Can, store, dry, salt, cure, etc the food when ready.

Don't go too far from a city. Maybe 1-2 hours away. Then you can go into town when you need to. Try to locate near some resources also. You could probably do all of this for less than $10,000 and be instantly retired. From there you can do whatever hobby or small business you like. You could pick up an occasional small job if you need some cash. I haven't done this but I've read about it and thought about it and stuff.

Interesting reply this is a way of living that has a strong appeal to me.

"I haven't done this but I've read about it"

Could you share some of your readings, if you don't mind?

[jacob]

Another option is moving to Detroit (or Lawndale in Chicago). In the "combat zones", you can score a house for <$5000. It's not that the houses are terrible. It's just that the neighbors are "unsafe". Think urban homesteading. Alternatively, dumpster diving. Roaming the backstreets for curb-stuff to sell and flip (I think this requires a license, but I don't know.)

[KevinW]

One idea: it may be possible to use a first time homebuyer program to buy a house, rent it out, live in a small part of it, and earn enough of a profit margin to cover a very lean ERE lifestyle. Somewhere I read about a family that lives in their basement and rents out their house; or rent out the house and live in a shack in the back yard. Something like that.

The answer is, get a small piece of land. You can get decent pieces for only a few $1,000. Next you build a small cabin. This can be done for as little as $2,000 or so. You set everything up so it's sustainable, low impact as far as resources go, renewable, etc. Then you make a robust garden that can support 70-85% of your food. Can, store, dry, salt, cure, etc the food when ready.

Don't go too far from a city. Maybe 1-2 hours away. Then you can go into town when you need to. Try to locate near some resources also. You could probably do all of this for less than $10,000 and be instantly retired. From there you can do whatever hobby or small business you like. You could pick up an occasional small job if you need some cash. I haven't done this but I've read about it and thought about it and stuff.

I've thought about this to. But I imagine "1-2 hours" means "1-2 hours by car;" how do you pay for running the car?

[jacob]

@Hexagon - Helen and Scott Nearing, Ralph Borsodi, Mark Boyle, Daniel Suelo.

@KevinW - The 2-flat approach is popular in Chicago. Spend $200k on the building, rent for $1200/month. Live free.

[vivacious]

Interesting reply this is a way of living that has a strong appeal to me.

"I haven't done this but I've read about it"

Could you share some of your readings, if you don't mind?

Sure. http://www.simplesolarhomesteading.com/ There's a good link to get started. This guy basically does everything I wrote about.

From there just use Google and your library and get books and info on buying land, cabins, preparing your own food, etc. Then you can get more info and learn more about the details and stuff.

[vivacious]

I've thought about this to. But I imagine "1-2 hours" means "1-2 hours by car;" how do you pay for running the car?

Well that's why I also mentioned to try to be near some resources. Try to be near bus or train access. This is easiest in Asia or Europe but possible in America also.

There are also various ridesharing websites and possibilities. Or trade favors with people near you.

Being near a bus or train stop would probably be best though.

[Seneca]

In most of the US, I think the better strategy for dumping a car is to make sure your main stuff is walking/bicycle distance.

Then actually walk or ride that fancy bike.

This is possible in a rural or city setting.

[vivacious]

Well yeah. But we were talking about if you had to go from a small homestead 1-2 hours away to the nearest main city. In which case some kind of public transportation or vehicle use would probably be needed.

[Seneca]

We are on plenty of land for a self sufficient homestead, and are 4mi from library, grocery, K-12 schools, resturants, gyms, karate, hardware/autoparts stores etc etc.

[jacob]

@Seneca - You probably paid more than a few thousand bucks for your land though, eh?

[Seneca]

@Seneca - You probably paid more than a few thousand bucks for your land though, eh?

We definitely are not on the no up front money plan.

I haven't tried to find few thousand dollar land as it lacks other things I'd want. It's not far to land under $100k that would fit (cycle to the nearest town). Not sure about under $10k.

Either way, public transpo is quite unlikely to serve a few thousand dollar plot of land in the middle of nowhere.

And a truck is pretty darn handy for this sort of lifestyle, but there are ways to do that REAL cheap. Rabbit diesel pickup anyone?