Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

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BRUTE
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by BRUTE »

Spartan_Warrior wrote:
Fri Apr 07, 2017 7:44 am
3) easy immigration policies

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Jean
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Jean »

Switzerland match those criterion.

RealPerson
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by RealPerson »

Your list describes many parts of the US, except for the affordable healthcare. So what is your reason for wanting to leave? I think almost any other place will be less compatible with your list than many cities/states in the US.

Spartan_Warrior
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Spartan_Warrior »

I didn't want to elaborate on this because I didn't and don't want this to become focused primarily on my reasons. That said, since so many have asked, I am interested in leaving for political/safety reasons. The new administration continuously demonstrates its danger to democracy and personal freedom here at home, not to mention there appears to be an increasing risk of world war abroad. This is also why I feel skeptical of major allied countries who would fight on America's side in a major world war. Sort of like being in Italy or Germany in the late 30s. Frankly I want to leave while I still can.

Additionally, it's no secret I don't particularly like where I live or my current job (although work from home has made it a big improvement). My net worth is up nicely the last few months, I'm soon to be married, and it seems like a good time to consider switching my lifestyle up and finding greener pastures. We've been looking for a place we can own some amount of land at a decent price and focus on homesteading. We've already been looking at places to move in the US for months, primarily CO and WV with occasional glances toward OR and WA. Like I said, the political changes in this country over the last few months have prompted me to broaden the search to outside the borders.

Disagree if you like, preferably not here, but those are my reasons.
NZers are sometimes not favourable to US politics though.
Sounds ideal.

NZ was where I've been leaning honestly. Ireland is intriguing as well because my fiancee seems able to claim citizenship due to her grandmother being born in Ireland.

ETA: Also I naturally listed my preferences in more or less order of importance. For instance, right to bear arms is last for a reason. It's really only important if some of the other criteria are not present (like 2 or 5).

ETA2: Actually, you know what, I'm going to make a different thread to discuss reasons in favor or against staying/being in America in the near future. I'd kinda rather this thread focus on practical matters of good countries that meet the criteria, what it's like to live in them, best ways to get in, etc.

ETA3: On third thought, I don't have the energy for the political debate that would surely entail. I do think the question is both separate enough from this topic and of global enough interest to deserve its own thread, but I'm not starting it now. If someone else wants to create a "Convince Me to Remain an American" thread (in the style of C40's timeless classic "Convince Me to Have Kids") go ahead. Or... or just bog this thread down with it... I guess it doesn't really matter.

Campitor
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Campitor »

Unless there is a total war similar to WW2, you should be safe moving to an isolated part of the US where neighbors are miles apart. If WW3 does break out, there will be nowhere safe to live. Research NZ living thoroughly, it's not the immigrant paradise you think it is.

If you don't mind the low/high risk of revolution, guerilla warfare, 3rd world medical infrastructure, or grease the palm to cut-the-red-tape bureaucracy , you should be able to find a tropical region to live in that is far off the political/strategical cross hairs.

George the original one
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by George the original one »

Right now good land/homes in Oregon & Washington are expensive, though last I checked there were a few properties suitable for homesteading in Long Beach, WA area in the <$200k price range if you don't mind living in a tsunami zone & can cope with grey wet windy conditions for 6 months.

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Ego
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Ego »

Spartan_Warrior wrote:
Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:26 am
I'm soon to be married, and it seems like a good time to consider switching my lifestyle up and finding greener pastures. We've been looking for a place we can own some amount of land at a decent price and focus on homesteading. We've already been looking at places to move in the US for months, primarily CO and WV with occasional glances toward OR and WA. Like I said, the political changes in this country over the last few months have prompted me to broaden the search to outside the borders.
If recent events have taught us anything it has taught us that the world is changing incredibly fast. And the pace of change continues to accelerate.

If you struggle with pinpointing a country where you want to homestead, let alone a state, city, or town.... why would you want to affix yourself and your wealth to any one place at this point in the journey? If you are anticipating a great deal of flux in the near future, wouldn't it make sense to have flexibility?

What can you accomplish by buying a homestead that you cannot accomplish by other means? Is it worth the loss of flexibility? Whenever I read about homesteaders, they always seem to buy a place, learn some hard lessons, then search for a different property that fixes their early mistakes. Is there some way to learn their lessons without having to pay the price for the mistakes?

For instance, https://www.workaway.info/

Laura Ingalls
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Laura Ingalls »

@Ego
Have you ever done workaway?
I am intrigued and have thought about campground hosting in the summer in the us and working at an organic farm, yoga retreat, or hostel in Costa Rica in the winter.

My brief experiment with county life was that it requires more capital (financial,social,emotional) than I ever would have thought. Urban chickens are easier fewer predators.

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Ego
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Ego »

@Laura Ingalls, On our last trip Mrs. Ego signed up for workaway. She taught yoga at a few but I don't remember if she got the yoga gigs from workaway. (Edit: Just logged in and found that we did not). We stayed at a number of places that used workaway volunteers in exchange for lodging and food. This hostel in Istanbul for instance....
http://www.hushhostelistanbul.com/default.aspx

Just a few of the hundreds of "permaculture" listings.

Help building an earthship in BC.
https://www.workaway.info/869619958998-en.html

or a permaculture homestead in TN.
https://www.workaway.info/779398881469-en.html

With meals and lodging provided, the lessons are free in exchange for work. You can move from one post to another, learning skills at each.

Spartan_Warrior
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Spartan_Warrior »

@Ego:

Good points and awesome resource, thanks!

Solvent
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Solvent »

I think Malaysia meets a lot of these conditions except 8.
I haven't spent a lot of time there but it's on my list of places to investigate. It's certainly not progressive, but apparently Penang, which has (I think) mostly Straits Chinese population, relative to the Malays, is a little more lax on the religious restrictions around alcohol, etc.

BRUTE
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by BRUTE »

it sounds like Spartan_Warrior is really looking for a cheap version of progressive US metro areas with low gun control measures. there is no such place. progressive metro areas are pricey for reasons. and they have strict gun control and high crime for reasons.

fwiw, all non-US English-speaking countries that brute knows of are extremely strict on gun control, and most non-English speaking ones as well.

price and high-tech are more a function of development level within the country, same as the US. the US midwest can be cheaper than Penang, if one accepts slower internet. and even third world countries can be expensive if Spartan_Warrior requires 50mbit and french cheeses. they will have them, but they'll cost as much in the US.

what's really cheap isn't cheap places, but living cheaply. humans in third world countries simply have much lower requirements. with similarly low requirements, life in the US can be similarly cheap.

interestingly, crime/safety seems completely unrelated to CoL, level of development, or city vs. rural. those might be small factors within a culture, but don't at all compare between cultures.

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Jean
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Jean »

Switzerland really does fit your criterions. Liberal neutral you can own guns safe, not as expensive as people imagine not strict on punctuation.

Solvent
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Solvent »

I think Switzerland has trouble with 1, 3, and 6. As far as cost if you're comparing cities with cities, and small towns with small towns, it would be more expensive than the US. Health care is very expensive, it's one of the few countries that can compare with the US in that aspect.

I'm certainly not an expert but I don't think it has easy immigration policies. But then again, I don't think many countries do, really, so I guess it does depend on where you set the bar for 'easy'. Switzerland's probably not worse than most.

saving-10-years
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by saving-10-years »

I'm soon to be married
Congratulations at @SW.

Scott 2
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Scott 2 »

You may also want to consider how an expat is taxed. The US has treaties with some countries, in others you could run into double taxation:

https://www.irs.gov/businesses/internat ... ies-a-to-z

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Jean
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Jean »

I pay 70 a month for health care wiht 2500 deductible. This is because my income is low.
Also, Geneva is really expensive, even for switzerland.
Soylent is right, BUT, you can live in the countryside, and you'll never be far from a city, an international airport, or the alps.

ThisDinosaur
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by ThisDinosaur »

US expats, how bad is the double taxation?

And @Campitor, what do you mean by "not an immigrant paradise," "3rd world medical infrastructure" and "risk of guerilla warfare?"

DW and I have been talking about NZ for a while. But I'm concerned about the bad combination of lower wages, higher expenses, and paying taxes in BOTH countries. Probably have to talk to a tax lawyer before making any commitments.

Did
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by Did »

If your wife can obtain Irish citizenship then that opens up the whole of the EU.

tradfgh
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Re: Best Countries for Americans to Immigrate

Post by tradfgh »

China has all of those, except easy immigration.

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