Near-Grad Sadness/Fear/Emptiness?

[TopHatFox]

Some random thoughts: the standard railroad from Elementary, Middle School, High School, College, and Work seems to be a drag. No matter how I change my thinking or behaviors--although this decreases the relative level of "suck" significantly--the absolute level of "suck" is still high.

Is this what modern western life is at best: a sort-of OK ride to FI until 30, where the absolute level of "suck" can then be changed by you, because then you are sufficient of an owner in the economic system, rather than only a worker? 30 years of life on an almost compulsory track is a long time to finally gain the choice to create your own track, goodness.

Don't get me wrong, my specific train on this railroad seems to be on the fast track, but it is still a disillusioning rail to be a part of, especially now without a primary partner to share it with. It feels like I now only have a job in a city, rather than the interesting tool to get to the dream shared with someone I love.

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Thoughts? Am I simply going to have to drag it out on this railroad for an additional 3 years, or 7?

I suppose I've already put in 17 years (subtracting childhood), and life could be much, much worse. Hm.

[BRUTE]

the real disappointment will be when Olaz finds out that his own track is just as boring a drag as the previous 30 years..

[TopHatFox]

Yeah, but at least then it's *my* track. It's like cooking your own meals, more interesting just 'cause you made it

[P_K]

To Brute's point, if one felt the first 30 years of one's life was a "drag," then it is probable the following 30 years will feel like a drag as well. To oppose Brute's point, this is more up to the individual than most realize. Try to slow down and realize this life - all its moments - are all you have. This will get easier as you age.

[TopHatFox]

I disagree with that idea P_K and brute. I think that irrelevent of the subjectivities of one's personality or life philosophy, under a western pre-FI context, the first 30 years might objectively offer sitting at a school desk, stressing over standardized testing, anxiety over getting into the "right college", completing all career assignments on time and well always, or other bullet points the average person would consider undesirable. If this section of life was a simulation called "School + Work: Earth, Part I", would a VR enthusiast want to play it?

Rather, what if that simulation objectively started to offer travel to 50 countries, the climbing of a really high mountain, finding love while sailing the seas, unravelling the mysteries of life by a fire and not worrying about deadlines, building a house with friends, and other activities generally considered desirable by the average person. We would call this one "Adventure + Life: Earth, Part II". Wouldn't a VR enthusiast be more likely to rate part II as more exciting and interesting than Part I? And thetefore want to play that one instead?

And if so, why do most of us choose to only play Part I?

[wood]

And if so, why do most of us choose to only play Part I?

Isn't that kinda obvious?

- It requires less skill/effort
- Fear of failure
- Status quo bias
- Short term pleasure prioritized over long term gain
- Do like others do
- Get acceptance from others

I've asked this type of question to a fair amount of people. Most people don't know what to do with their time. They put alot of things on auto-pilot. I think many lack curiosity and imagination. This makes sense because curiosity and imagination is something children have, but is in many ways punished for. Most people just want a simple life.

[vexed87]

WRT to your VR analogy, I think people are not particularly keen to commit to the whole travel the world thing, you can do it essentially on a tiny budget if you really wanted to, but our culture tells another story, primarily if you get your head down you can be a millionaire/rock star/famous. Most people wouldn't be prepared to cope with the hardship that would come with travelling on a minuscule budget, to do it in typical developed world comfort would require resources far beyond the reach of most fresh graduates or kids. VR would take the commitment and the hardship out of it. In the VR world, sure they'll choose adventure over school, but in the real world the majority choose school and work in the hope that one day they might have the resources to pursue their dreams, this is the solution presented by the status quo.

Most people want a comfortable life, and the status quo offers it. No need to think, plan ahead or push boundaries hard to meet those typical goals, just bumble along and it'll all be all-right. Of course, if you are happy with the status quo, then there's no reason reason to waste energy thinking outside of that box. Thinking is hard. Going against the grain is harder. The reason everyone else is happy doing what they are doing is because their personality doesn't steer them to think outside that box for solutions. It just so happens that the people who traverse the world on a tiny budget, or stumble upon this forum were looking to their own solution to a problem that the status quo doesn't solve, primarily they do so because their personality opens their minds to beyond what the dominant culture offers them.

What's brilliant about ERE is that it teaches us that we already have the resources (skills, not money) we need to pursue our dreams, we just need to learn to grab them (develop them!). Obviously, if we want to live within our culture, we have to submit to it to a degree, that's society for you. I look back on my time in various institutions as doing my bit to be free. The more integrated we want to be with our culture, the more time we have to do.

[BeyondtheWrap]

the first 30 years might objectively offer sitting at a school desk, stressing over standardized testing, anxiety over getting into the "right college"

There is no objective requirement that you have to feel stressed or feel anxiety. You just have to do the things.

Rather, what if that simulation objectively started to offer travel to 50 countries, the climbing of a really high mountain, finding love while sailing the seas, unravelling the mysteries of life by a fire and not worrying about deadlines, building a house with friends, and other activities generally considered desirable by the average person.

The things you listed are also examples of things that objectively suck. Travel to 50 countries? Everyone hates having to get up early to go to the airport, stand in line, and go through airport security only to be jetlagged for the entirety of their vacation while standing around on boring tours. Sailing the seas? Yeah if you want to get seasick and have water splashed on you all the time and be so far from civilization that if you die at sea there's nothing anyone can do. Climbing a really high mountain and building a house? You know how exhausting those things are and how lazy people are? Those are things that expose you to the elements and require you to exert yourself physically and also put yourself at risk of injury. There's a reason people outsource construction, it's because it's not fun for the majority of people.

[C40]

This is all just a game. You basically have to play it. Part of winning this game is being able to make fun out of it. If you think of this phase of life only as a drag, and approach it only as something to endure until a next phase, well, then, you're losing the game. And you're also not preparing very well for success in the next phases of life.

Edit - And to add, one part of this game is also to be able to endure relationships ending and bounce back. I don't mean that you seem to be failing at this, just pointing out that maybe your recent relationship challenges or endings may be contributing to how you're feeling about how empty the School/Work phase of life is

[mrcupcake]

...the standard railroad from Elementary, Middle School, High School, College, and Work seems to be a drag.

This reminded me of Music and Life by Alan Watts. He uses music as a metaphor for life; the point is not to get to the final note but to enjoy the journey.

When I first saw the video, the carrot-on-a-stick progression through school, college, career really resonated with me. Each next step always felt like the essential upgrade, so I would live for that future state instead of cherishing the present (not always, but too often). When you get to a career point where ERE is the next upgrade, it is easy to see it as the "final boss" or end game that will open up a new paradise.

While ERE does open up brand new possibilities, it is still just a new verse of the same song. If I could do some college/career things over again, I would have enjoyed the music more and carrot-chased less.

[TopHatFox]

This is all just a game. You basically have to play it. Part of winning this game is being able to make fun out of it. If you think of this phase of life only as a drag, and approach it only as something to endure until a next phase, well, then, you're losing the game. And you're also not preparing very well for success in the next phases of life.

Edit - And to add, one part of this game is also to be able to endure relationships ending and bounce back. I don't mean that you seem to be failing at this, just pointing out that maybe your recent relationship challenges or endings may be contributing to how you're feeling about how empty the School/Work phase of life is

Primary-form partner of one year and I split last week, so it's not very good, I can tell you that. Secondary-form partner is too busy studying for a chem midterm and close friends are usually busy too, so it's just me and homework I don't want to do most days.

I mean, I'm still doing all the "right" things, such as working out, eating healthfully, grooming, showing up to class (mostly), watching uplifting YouTube videos, saving, scheduling a counseling center appointment, etc., but I feel lonely/depressed, and AC is known for being a lonely and stressful college without heart ache (stats to back this up are prevalent). I suppose time is the healer and all that. I'm trying the No-Contact Rule, and I'll see if that helps in getting my body out of withdrawal from the PF relationship.

[Dragline]

Yes, it does. But your experience is not uncommon as college is kind of an artificially constructed world where you are with a certain group of people for a certain time. At the end of the time period, there can be dislocations as people prepare for their next stage in life, or fail to prepare as the case may be. Having people freak out or make sudden changes just before graduation is pretty common.

What its telling you is that its coming time to close this chapter of life and begin a new one. Many chapters end in bittersweet places.

BTW, you are nowhere close to your optimal stopping point for dating, career or anything else. Read this and take heart: https://medium.com/galleys/optimal-stop ... .tjmtvfc7x

[James_0011]

I think more people would ere if they even knew it was an option. It was baffling to me when I discovered I didn't have to work my whole life, even though its really an obvious concept.

Women come and go, its no big deal really. No contact is a great practice imo, so is hooking up with someone else.

[BRUTE]

This is all just a game. You basically have to play it.

citation needed

[BRUTE]

Rather, what if that simulation objectively started to offer travel to 50 countries, the climbing of a really high mountain, finding love while sailing the seas, unravelling the mysteries of life by a fire and not worrying about deadlines, building a house with friends, and other activities generally considered desirable by the average person. We would call this one "Adventure + Life: Earth, Part II". Wouldn't a VR enthusiast be more likely to rate part II as more exciting and interesting than Part I? And thetefore want to play that one instead?

well, what can brute say - he went back from Part 2 to Part 1 because adventure and travel get as boring as school or work do.

[TopHatFox]

Curious, from what adventure/travel to what work did brute go to? I do agree that adventure and travel need to be tied with a mission of some sort to be meaningful long-term.

[Ego]

Through whatever combination of smarts and determination and social engineering and the hundred other characteristics you employed in the effort, you managed to get through one of the best and most expensive schools in the world AND saved nearly $50K while doing it.... at a time when virtually ever other student is graduating with double that in debt.

You are starting your career with a good chunk of FU money. You'll probably never need to use it because you are who you are, but the psychological benefit of knowing it is entirely your decision to be exactly where you, that you are not trapped by debt or bills or mouths to feed, makes it so much easier to deal with the day-to-day stress of a real job.

This IS the adventure.

[TopHatFox]

Thank you Ego, that means a lot : )

[Sclass]

Yeah, thanks Ego. I feel like stealing that for myself at the moment.

olaz, sounds like a good time to me. I'm just lying here thinking of how cool it would be to go back thirty years somehow and relive my own suck...knowing what I know now.

Sounds like you're living dude.

Investment isn't always fun in the moment. I ate a lot of sh.t to get the tiny piece of the world I own. I'd sit down at the pile in a blink if you'd give me another crack at it.

[BRUTE]

Curious, from what adventure/travel to what work did brute go to? I do agree that adventure and travel need to be tied with a mission of some sort to be meaningful long-term.

travel on most continents over several years. both more quick/touristy and slow-travel or whatever the hip kids call it now, i.e. living in one place for months at a time. doing whatever brute wanted. making friends, learning languages (or bits of them), reading, writing, riding motorcycles, doing boat tours, getting shown around a Favela by a local, watching soccer matches between random clubs brute had never heard of, learning to cook local foods, train in local sports..

all these were just fleeting distractions. with work, brute feels like he has a somewhat more permanent distraction, at least for now. plus, he wasn't FI, only FU. work involves typing on computers all day long.