Possible ERE City -- Berlin, Germany

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NYC ERE
Posts: 433
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2010 8:03 pm

Post by NYC ERE »

American obsession with Berlin is nothing new--there are a lot of expats there, which could be a plus and a minus, depending on the reason for one's interest in living in a different country. The young people in German cities more often than not speak English.
I spent six weeks riding a bicycle around Germany three years ago, and discovered that housing is mind-blowingly cheap just about everywhere. For example, a reasonable-sized 1BR in Berlin and other cities at the time (2007) cost 50,000 euros. Besides high income taxes and a lack of an "ownership society" as in the US, the reason for low housing costs is that most/all mortgages require a 40% down payment, which disqualifies a lot of potential buyers, thus lowering the demand for real estate.
Another great feature in Germany for EREs is general bicycle-friendliness; I've never felt safer riding anywhere, except perhaps in the Netherlands, and there's a well-developed bicycle-only "interstate" traversing the entire country.
As an alternative city, Dresden still has a lot of Soviet-era housing stock that rents incredibly cheaply. My touring partner and I stayed in one couple's place there who (again, 2007) paid 150 euros a month for a three-room flat. The toilet was down the hall and the kitchen sink was also the bathtub, but it was quite spacious and charming in a concrete (literally), Soviet sense.
I have no idea about the intricacies of visas, property taxes, etc. connected to a scheme like this, but if it's navigable and affordable, German cities offer an urban option for ERE.


Concojones
Posts: 117
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 6:57 am

Post by Concojones »

Wow, my country is next to Germany and I had no idea housing is so dirt cheap there! Now that I think of it, I do remember Ferriss mentioning in his book that rent is dirt cheap in the artists' quarter of Berlin. I was surprised when I read that, but now it makes sense.
The cities you mention lie in Eastern Germany, which was long occupied by the Soviets and only reunited 20 years ago, so the economy is still lagging behind. Think: the Midwest.
Visa might be a problem. I know it is a problem if a person from the US/EU wants to live AND WORK in the other block (EU/US). But how about living and not working? Anyone know if Europeans can retire in the US? (I'm quite sure it's the same the other way around.)


fandor
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Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:14 pm

Post by fandor »

Well, housing is cheap in former East Germany however utilities are quite expensive and it's getting up all the time.
I would recommend cities and towns in Saxony (south from Berlin). Really great option is Dresden. Beautiful city, very bike friendly, a lot of students (there is good technical university), one of the lowest living expenses in Germany, but also many cultural and sport events.
There are also smaller cities or town like Gorlitz (on the border with Poland). It is 50k town with beautifully restored city center, you can buy there newly remodelled two bedroom apartment for around 40k EUR right in historical city center.
The are cons - mostly the fact younger people leave the cities (and Saxony) because there are almost any jobs.


fandor
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Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:14 pm

Post by fandor »

By the way - I am just in process of buying small one bedroom apartment (about 400 sq feet) in a czech village (close to national park Sachsen Switzerland) about 1 hours driving from Dresden for -- wait for it -- 8k USD. Monthly bill for utilities is around 40 bucks. Property tax is probably around 20 USD / year.


JohnnyH
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Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:00 pm
Location: Rockies

Post by JohnnyH »

@Fandor: are you a czech citizen? EU citizen?... That's sounds pretty nice :)


Concojones
Posts: 117
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 6:57 am

Post by Concojones »

Wow, $8k, that's quite a deal! Translated into monthly cashflow, that's $30/month + utilities.


fandor
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Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:14 pm

Post by fandor »

I am Czech (citizen). It is quite complicated to buy properties for foreigners in the Czech Republic, basically you have to establish limited company (SRO) which will own your assets (many fees, company tax return every year, ...) - pain in ass.
Otherwise Czech Republic is nice calm country to live in and cheap if you live outside the Prague. Best cities for living are probably Brno, Olomouc and Liberec (the last one is for outdoor enthusiasts - you can bike, ski, ... there and it is just steps from German/Polish borders). All of mentioned cities have one or more universities (young crowds), are about 100k population each, walking friendly (also some biking too), younger people (<35 sears old) can usually speak/understand some English or German. Full health insurance (no deductions) for residents starts from 60 USD / month, healthcare has pretty high standard.
University education is still free, but it will change soon, but they are planning just "symbolic" fee for about 500-1000 USD a year.
I work as selfemployed and for 2009 I paid about 12% income tax (there is
So not bad country to live in, especially when you have western countries income :-)


Concojones
Posts: 117
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 6:57 am

Post by Concojones »

@fandor: interesting! I'm looking on a map as we speak and I'm also looking more South because I hope the weather may be better (I'm from Belgium). One town I see is Ceské Budejovice, not too far from München and Austria. Do you know anything about it? I'm guessing it may be more expensive due to the proximity of wealthy München and Austria.


fandor
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:14 pm

Post by fandor »

@Concojones Ceske Budejovice are another regional capital of South Bohemia on the same level as Brno, Olomouc or Liberec in all meanings, so it isn't more expensive than mentioned cities, maybe it is little bit cheaper because there is nothing special. There is also no expat community in comparison to Olomouc and especially Brno, which is also southeast by the way. My operates great website about Brno - it is http://www.brnonow.com and I operate http://www.brno101.com Check it out ;)


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