There's something to be said for the military. 20 year retirement career route... VA health benefits... training... Money towards education.
I'd also try to live somewhere with a high cost of living when you are young and working (real estate, salaries...), then move somewhere with a low cost of living when you want to retire.
Create the PERFECT ERE Life...
Great topic.
If I could "do it all again", I would only do a few things differently: waste less money in my late teens and early 20s, take better care of my vehicles, discover ERE when I was young and learn about real estate/investing earlier on.
I would still go to college (since my parents paid for it and because I met my wife there) and I would still have studied in the same field.
If I had learned and applied the ERE principles sooner (I knew I didn't want to work when I was 18) I would probably be done working by now... Oh well! I try not to focus on what could have happened and instead focus on what WILL happen now that I have taken conscious control of my financial destiny and have drawn up a plan.
On an earlier topic, I think there are a few key areas which are basically recession/depression proof/resistant: death, taxes, birth, and marriage. From this you could draw a few professions which are unlikely to disappear or suffer: undertaker/funeral director, CPA, midwife, anything related to daycare (since there are still so many working moms/dads), wedding planner, wedding officiant, florist, formal-wear rental. Obviously, some are less resilient than others. I would also add "landlord" to that list since people will always need a place to live.
If I could "do it all again", I would only do a few things differently: waste less money in my late teens and early 20s, take better care of my vehicles, discover ERE when I was young and learn about real estate/investing earlier on.
I would still go to college (since my parents paid for it and because I met my wife there) and I would still have studied in the same field.
If I had learned and applied the ERE principles sooner (I knew I didn't want to work when I was 18) I would probably be done working by now... Oh well! I try not to focus on what could have happened and instead focus on what WILL happen now that I have taken conscious control of my financial destiny and have drawn up a plan.
On an earlier topic, I think there are a few key areas which are basically recession/depression proof/resistant: death, taxes, birth, and marriage. From this you could draw a few professions which are unlikely to disappear or suffer: undertaker/funeral director, CPA, midwife, anything related to daycare (since there are still so many working moms/dads), wedding planner, wedding officiant, florist, formal-wear rental. Obviously, some are less resilient than others. I would also add "landlord" to that list since people will always need a place to live.
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DividendGuy
- Posts: 441
- Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 9:58 pm
Great topic!
I'd only make a few changes, but major changes. I would have never gone to college and therefore never would have racked up student loan debt. The field I am in now requires no degree and doesn't make a difference on my paycheck. I would have never financed any vehicles. I would have been frugal all along and invested earlier. I would have lived with my parents longer. I would probably be on a path to retire at 30 if all those changes could have been made. Experience is expensive and I suppose I will appreciate the end result much more because of the hardships endured during the process.
I'd only make a few changes, but major changes. I would have never gone to college and therefore never would have racked up student loan debt. The field I am in now requires no degree and doesn't make a difference on my paycheck. I would have never financed any vehicles. I would have been frugal all along and invested earlier. I would have lived with my parents longer. I would probably be on a path to retire at 30 if all those changes could have been made. Experience is expensive and I suppose I will appreciate the end result much more because of the hardships endured during the process.
I would have done the 4 year engineering degree (I did) and then joined the military to be a pilot (I didn't because of the 10 year commitment required). I wouldn't want to retire at all if I was flying fighter jets and blowing stuff up for a living. Then after 20 years you get excellent retirement benefits and free medical for life.
Another great career path money wise is a federal fire fighter. My cousin works as a federal fire fighter on military bases. he has worked in Kuwait, Marshall Islands, Crete, Tennessee, Area 51 in Nevada, California, and other fun places. He gets paid to sleep and play video games and watch movies 95% of the time. He makes about the same salary I do (and I did 6 years engineering school) but since he gets paid to sleep his actual work time is much less. He retires at 75% pay after 20 years. Also chicks dig firefighters.
Another great career path money wise is a federal fire fighter. My cousin works as a federal fire fighter on military bases. he has worked in Kuwait, Marshall Islands, Crete, Tennessee, Area 51 in Nevada, California, and other fun places. He gets paid to sleep and play video games and watch movies 95% of the time. He makes about the same salary I do (and I did 6 years engineering school) but since he gets paid to sleep his actual work time is much less. He retires at 75% pay after 20 years. Also chicks dig firefighters.
This thread is great!
Here is what I would do differently...
I would have taken the GED at age 16 instead of staying to graduate from high school. I would have networked my way into a plumbing apprenticeship while mowing lawns in the evenings and on weekends (I was already doing this at the time with school).
That would put me at around 21 when I received my plumbing license. At that time, I would have sold my interest in the lawn business as well as all equipment.
I would take those proceeds and by a house with cash on a few acres outside of town with a shop/barn. This should be easily attainable with the low price of real estate in my area as well as savings from those five years.
I would then focus on becoming a better businessman. I would enroll at the local community college taking classes in accounting, finance, and marketing. I think I could complete all I need to know within four semesters of evening classes.
That would then put me at 23 or so. I would marry my current wife at this point and hopefully start a family within a few years and she wouldn't need to work due to my diligent planning (I'm not a fan of "parental outsourcing" and I want a big family someday).
After two more years of saving and working overtime, I would go out on my own with a plumbing business.
This would put me at 25 (where I currently sit). I think it would be realistic to have a paid for house, shop, and tools, start up capital for the plumbing business, retirement investments in the 150K range, and a decent sized emergency fund if all else failed.
After 10 or so years of hard work, I could easily retire without ever thinking about money again
That would be my plan...
Here is what I would do differently...
I would have taken the GED at age 16 instead of staying to graduate from high school. I would have networked my way into a plumbing apprenticeship while mowing lawns in the evenings and on weekends (I was already doing this at the time with school).
That would put me at around 21 when I received my plumbing license. At that time, I would have sold my interest in the lawn business as well as all equipment.
I would take those proceeds and by a house with cash on a few acres outside of town with a shop/barn. This should be easily attainable with the low price of real estate in my area as well as savings from those five years.
I would then focus on becoming a better businessman. I would enroll at the local community college taking classes in accounting, finance, and marketing. I think I could complete all I need to know within four semesters of evening classes.
That would then put me at 23 or so. I would marry my current wife at this point and hopefully start a family within a few years and she wouldn't need to work due to my diligent planning (I'm not a fan of "parental outsourcing" and I want a big family someday).
After two more years of saving and working overtime, I would go out on my own with a plumbing business.
This would put me at 25 (where I currently sit). I think it would be realistic to have a paid for house, shop, and tools, start up capital for the plumbing business, retirement investments in the 150K range, and a decent sized emergency fund if all else failed.
After 10 or so years of hard work, I could easily retire without ever thinking about money again
That would be my plan...
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HeOfTheMountains
- Posts: 35
- Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2011 10:23 pm
I would have taken a job after graduating high school instead of being aimless in college. I would have bought a modest house to live in and get roommates to pay the mortgage. After 3 years (minimum residency requirement if I got a mortgage from a bank), bought another house, move into that with roommates. Rent out the first one outright. Rinse and repeat until I had ten houses. One house a year. By 28 I would have had at least 10 houses and a healthy income to retire into.
Of course, it would have required getting owner-financed loans, instead of depending on the bank. If owner-financed, I would have either stayed at my parents until age 21 while picking up houses, or rented an apartment with a roommate while picking up houses until the cash flow improved enough.
Of course, it would have required getting owner-financed loans, instead of depending on the bank. If owner-financed, I would have either stayed at my parents until age 21 while picking up houses, or rented an apartment with a roommate while picking up houses until the cash flow improved enough.
If I went back and handed 18 year old me the ERE book, I would think it was pretty cool, shrug, and cave to societal and familial pressure again. Learning to get off my duff and DO something, especially something against the grain, was not something I had learned at 18 years old.
There's more to accomplishing things than knowing information. You have to be willing to DO something with it.
There's more to accomplishing things than knowing information. You have to be willing to DO something with it.
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TheWanderingScholar
- Posts: 650
- Joined: Thu Dec 30, 2010 12:04 am
Well I am sixteen so I have leg up on everyone else (well besides AlexOliver and other young people).
Well here is my plan:
16-18: Work on writing and release "99 cent" short story series so I can get some reputation and make some money. During then work on the blog so I can have a following and work on marketing, basically work by word-of-mouth. Apply for as many grants and scholarships as possible, to cover cost and then some. Buy the tri-scooter (A trike but in scooter form.). Cost only 3k at most and fifty miles a gallon, which is pretty high.
After high school and college:
Go Texas State Technical College in Waco and specialize in Nanotechnology (for now)! (Two year program, so cheaper than a standard four year degree. In theory)
Work on writing still, maybe release a novel.
Get a part time job.
Blog continues
After college and job:
Work, write,blog, and invest until I have 250k in stocks with dividends at least of 4% and 50k in the bank.
Execution of plan!:
Move to Philippines and buy me land and a small house by the sea shore. And write while drinking 50 cents beer!
.
After all that?
Well either get hitched to a travelling expat.
Work volunteer work.
Start a business
Or whatever happens, happens.
Like the last one the best.
Well here is my plan:
16-18: Work on writing and release "99 cent" short story series so I can get some reputation and make some money. During then work on the blog so I can have a following and work on marketing, basically work by word-of-mouth. Apply for as many grants and scholarships as possible, to cover cost and then some. Buy the tri-scooter (A trike but in scooter form.). Cost only 3k at most and fifty miles a gallon, which is pretty high.
After high school and college:
Go Texas State Technical College in Waco and specialize in Nanotechnology (for now)! (Two year program, so cheaper than a standard four year degree. In theory)
Work on writing still, maybe release a novel.
Get a part time job.
Blog continues
After college and job:
Work, write,blog, and invest until I have 250k in stocks with dividends at least of 4% and 50k in the bank.
Execution of plan!:
Move to Philippines and buy me land and a small house by the sea shore. And write while drinking 50 cents beer!
. After all that?
Well either get hitched to a travelling expat.
Work volunteer work.
Start a business
Or whatever happens, happens.
Like the last one the best.
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George the other one
- Posts: 52
- Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 11:55 pm
- Contact:
@YoungAndWise
If cheep beer is you're objective we have plenty of it in Wisconsin... just move here instead.
Minhas here sells for $4 a brick which comes out to be 17 cents a can.
I scored 60 cans of Old Milwaukee last year for 11 cents a can.
Point Special and Leinenkugels are usually on sale for 60 cents a can.
Blatz sells for about 25 cents a can.
Trust me, if you're goal is cheep beer you want to live in Wisconsin.
If cheep beer is you're objective we have plenty of it in Wisconsin... just move here instead.
Minhas here sells for $4 a brick which comes out to be 17 cents a can.
I scored 60 cans of Old Milwaukee last year for 11 cents a can.
Point Special and Leinenkugels are usually on sale for 60 cents a can.
Blatz sells for about 25 cents a can.
Trust me, if you're goal is cheep beer you want to live in Wisconsin.
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TheWanderingScholar
- Posts: 650
- Joined: Thu Dec 30, 2010 12:04 am
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white belt
- Posts: 1457
- Joined: Sat May 21, 2011 12:15 am
This thread intrigues me because I'm actually at this point in my life right now. I've narrowed it down to essentially two options:
Option A: Go to college and a get a degree in the arts or sciences (at the moment I'm leaning towards economics). This is primarily because I really enjoy learning, but also somewhat influenced by societal expectations. I'll work a day or two a week at a bicycle shop and take summer classes to graduate early. By the time I graduate I should have enough bicycle repair experience to start my own repair business or at least get a decent-paying job in shop.
Option B: Become a carpenter's apprentice. I looked into the program and it is taking applications over the next couple of weeks. As Jacob mentioned in his post, the apprenticeship is four years with an increasing salary that starts at around $17/hour. I could still work one day a week at a bicycle shop to learn bicycle repair. After the four years I can move wherever a want and should be able to find work relatively easily at ~$40 an hour.
Option B is a much more non-conformist approach, at least in my family (both my parents have advanced degrees). I believe I can gain most of the academic knowledge that I would get with Option A by just studying the textbooks/subjects on my own.
Either way, I have a lot of thinking to do before I make a decision. I enjoy reading the responses in this thread, so props to jeremymday for starting this.
Option A: Go to college and a get a degree in the arts or sciences (at the moment I'm leaning towards economics). This is primarily because I really enjoy learning, but also somewhat influenced by societal expectations. I'll work a day or two a week at a bicycle shop and take summer classes to graduate early. By the time I graduate I should have enough bicycle repair experience to start my own repair business or at least get a decent-paying job in shop.
Option B: Become a carpenter's apprentice. I looked into the program and it is taking applications over the next couple of weeks. As Jacob mentioned in his post, the apprenticeship is four years with an increasing salary that starts at around $17/hour. I could still work one day a week at a bicycle shop to learn bicycle repair. After the four years I can move wherever a want and should be able to find work relatively easily at ~$40 an hour.
Option B is a much more non-conformist approach, at least in my family (both my parents have advanced degrees). I believe I can gain most of the academic knowledge that I would get with Option A by just studying the textbooks/subjects on my own.
Either way, I have a lot of thinking to do before I make a decision. I enjoy reading the responses in this thread, so props to jeremymday for starting this.
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jacob
- Site Admin
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- Contact:
@white belt - Given your aspirations, definitely do not go into [student] debt to get a certificate/degree you don't intend to use for a white collar job anyway. If you can do it without debt, you'll pay opportunity cost only.
I have subsequently learned that carpentry is considered fairly backbreaking work until you reach the master carpenter level at which point others would be doing the heavy lifting. I was actively discouraged from going into it due to my age(!). I suspect this mainly holds for framing and not so for cabinet and furniture making. The $17/hour also varies. I think milling pays much less (close to minimum wage).
I assume you're familiar with Rivendell Bicycleworks and the famous Grant Petersen? I believe he either dropped out of grad school or finished his PhD and didn't use it. Then got a job as a designer for Bridgestone/Cannondale and subsequently cashed out his 401k/IRA ($85000) to start Rivendell.
I have subsequently learned that carpentry is considered fairly backbreaking work until you reach the master carpenter level at which point others would be doing the heavy lifting. I was actively discouraged from going into it due to my age(!). I suspect this mainly holds for framing and not so for cabinet and furniture making. The $17/hour also varies. I think milling pays much less (close to minimum wage).
I assume you're familiar with Rivendell Bicycleworks and the famous Grant Petersen? I believe he either dropped out of grad school or finished his PhD and didn't use it. Then got a job as a designer for Bridgestone/Cannondale and subsequently cashed out his 401k/IRA ($85000) to start Rivendell.
Oh if I could go back...
All those years of financial boom and corporate credit cards that I spent stripping once a week while getting a useless degree and volunteering full time? I should have just made money for a few years.
Other than that - I wish I could have developed professionally faster but that's really been inseparable from my personal growth which probably couldn't have gone any faster. I should have put more effort into developing my erotic capital sooner tho. However, with the current state of the economy and sex industry I wouldn't advise this path to an unskilled young person - the learning curve and competition are too steep.
And I should have taken my friends advice back in the day to never live east of the Mississippi.
All those years of financial boom and corporate credit cards that I spent stripping once a week while getting a useless degree and volunteering full time? I should have just made money for a few years.
Other than that - I wish I could have developed professionally faster but that's really been inseparable from my personal growth which probably couldn't have gone any faster. I should have put more effort into developing my erotic capital sooner tho. However, with the current state of the economy and sex industry I wouldn't advise this path to an unskilled young person - the learning curve and competition are too steep.
And I should have taken my friends advice back in the day to never live east of the Mississippi.
I missed this thread first time around. Love it. If I were starting over knowing what I know now, I would become an auto mechanic and post-pone college until I was old enough to make real use of the experience. I would open a repair shop and employ all women mechanics (like me), and we would cater to women and men who are intimidated by most mainstream auto repair shops.
Interesting that I don't even think about early retirement, but rather working at something that I believe would be more fun than my job now! However, I would still live very frugally so that I could be FI ASAP, and as the owner of the shop I could work whatever hours I want. And with a useful skill I would feel more secure moving around the country as I felt like it.
Interesting that I don't even think about early retirement, but rather working at something that I believe would be more fun than my job now! However, I would still live very frugally so that I could be FI ASAP, and as the owner of the shop I could work whatever hours I want. And with a useful skill I would feel more secure moving around the country as I felt like it.
LOVE the female repair job plan! The biggest difference I would see is having a quiet place somewhere with a table and some chairs and sitting down while discussing the car problem(s) and the (cost of) repairs. Doesn't need to be pink for me.
As for the original question: I would have loved it if somebody had told me that working until age 65 wasn't the only option. I'm glad with my education and career so far, but that's also because the education was almost free (government-sponsored).
As for the original question: I would have loved it if somebody had told me that working until age 65 wasn't the only option. I'm glad with my education and career so far, but that's also because the education was almost free (government-sponsored).