Analog or Digital?

[denise]

My landlord just left after fixing my washing machine. We got to talking about the analog versus digital washing machines. Mine somehow got stuck in a phase, and he luckily, somehow fixed it, but were lamenting the good ol' days when you could just skip cycles and troubleshoot easily.

Do you all have a preference for either analog or digital household appliances?

I'm holding on to my soon to be 13 year old car, for hopefully another couple years. I'm researching cars now, and my new one will probably be either a Mazda 3 or a Tesla 3, but the whole totally digital aspect of the Tesla 3 has me cautious.

[jacob]

I believe fairly strongly in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appropriate_technology and I think it's strategically [ERE] wise not getting too involved with technology one doesn't personally know how to maintain and fix. This means I try to draw the technology-line at the electro-mechanical level if at all possible because this is the limit of my technical knowledge. Ideally, I also prefer and try to build what I use. Building is a good way to throughly understand something. This quote strikes a little too close to comfort for me:

The available worlds looked pretty grim. They had little to offer him because he had little to offer them. He had been extremely chastened to realize that although he originally came from a world which had cars and computers and ballet and Armagnac, he didn't, by himself, know how any of it worked. He couldn't do it. Left to his own devices he couldn't build a toaster. He could just about make a sandwich and that was it.

Digital to me falls under "necessary evil" and I think of such devices as a "service" (rather than an asset) "subject to loss" trying to minimize both cost and the development of dependence.

In terms of washing machines, I'm actually thinking of buying or building something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/GetPreparedStuff ... B002QSXK60
Along with using our "vintage" double concrete sink in the basement.

[BRUTE]

why not just hang dry/lie flat (for wool) ?

there's a thread in here where various members vigorously discuss manual washing techniques. brute has been washing his clothes by hand for just about a year now. he still does a machine load every 2-4 weeks for bed sheets or other items where he's too lazy to wash them by hand.

it's not an issue. clothes are cleaner and it's probably less stressful for the fabric.

[jacob]

Because ... handwringing doesn't work for my combination of laziness, climate, and indoor thermostat settings. Past experience indicates that clothes takes 3+ days to dry which is too long before it starts smelling like "old socks".

[BRUTE]

centrifuging might be an option, too, instead of pressing. brute agrees that longer than 24h drying time starts to get nasty.

[jacob]

Well, I do centrifuge my ketchup bottles.

There would be a solution for my climate if house heating still operated from a stove in which case the clothes could easily be dried from the intense radiative heat by hanging it up around the stove. Unfortunately, we now have central heating and that just wont do. Also it's currently OFF until sometime in November. Hence, I'm a situation of silly path-dependent lock-in. Buyer beware!

[Ego]

Hang it in the basement with a fan?

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

A fan really makes a huge difference ime. Ceiling is less intrusive and perhaps already available, but box fans will work too (although they might need to be rotated around the drying rack).

[BeyondtheWrap]

In 2012 I was shopping for a new stove at Home Depot. I rejected out of hand any models where the control for the stove was digital; I wanted to turn a knob, dammit. I got my wish, but unfortunately all of the available models only had digital controls for the oven part, but I guess that's fine since I never use the oven anyway.

[vexed87]

My brother in law has a victorian building with high ceilings. They dry their clothes on one of these which is hung above the fireplace which runs on waste wood, seasoned wood or coal when wood is scarce. I'm impressed with the setup and it gets stuff dry quick!

Personally, I have a hand powered mechanical replacement for near everything that uses electricity if it's something I couldn't bear to live without if SHTF. This does result in some near term duplication of goods, but I rarely now use electric gadgets and am in the process of letting go/giving away most of the stuff that DW isn't attached to. However she is not prepared to give away the toaster or coffee machine, both of which I rarely use myself, preferring the grill on the oven and and good ole cafetiere.

I don't yet practice alternatives to the electric stove and oven, but I have the plans to build a cob oven and have a cast iron dutch oven stowed away in case the electric grid goes down. I also have plans to build a hay-box, but DW thinks I'm being OTT so haven't gotten around to any of those yet.

One day I'll convince DW to let me build cob oven and I'll sell it as wanting to bake authentic pizza. I just need my own sizeable garden area first!

[cmonkey]

I don't yet practice alternatives to the electric stove and oven, but I have the plans to build a cob oven and have a cast iron dutch oven stowed away in case the electric grid goes down.

We are going to build a cob oven as well, and next spring I am going to start cooking some meals outdoors in our garden's firepit in an attempt to cut down on electric range use. I need to find some cast iron pans though. The cob oven is going to be built sufficiently close enough to use in the winter if I need. All utilizing the steady stream of free firewood on craiglist.

[Dragline]

Do you all have a preference for either analog or digital household appliances?

I'm holding on to my soon to be 13 year old car, for hopefully another couple years. I'm researching cars now, and my new one will probably be either a Mazda 3 or a Tesla 3, but the whole totally digital aspect of the Tesla 3 has me cautious.

I generally agree with jacob that simpler is usually better, whether analog or digital. But I think its only one factor in choosing such things.

On the cars, I'd say that we have come to a juncture where the electronics in the car are likely to go bad and be practically unfixable long before the mechanical components wear out. This is one of the key factors in why luxury vehicles depreciate so quickly. High-end German models are now notorious for going bad electronically in less than a decade and costing more than their worth to fix.

Tesla's may be fine, but you just don't know because they have not been around that long. As a comparison, I would not have bought a Prius when they were new, because there's no way of really knowing whether the technology would hold up. It's clear now after years of being on the road that they have "passed the reliability test", so they would be on the list. I still think you get a better deal for the most part with an older, gas-powered Toyota or Scion, which is made by Toyota.

What's kind of funny is that often the best place to find such a vehicle in good condition is at a high-end dealership like a Mercedes shop, because they take them as trade-ins and don't really want them, but will only sell the ones to the public that are reliable so they can preserve their reputations. They dump the bad cars at auction or to lower-end used car lots. A couple years ago I was helping a relative find a car and the one he ended up getting was a used Scion from a Bentley dealership. BTW, I would look at those because most of them are very simple cars with not much to break on them.

Being a "late adopter" of technology is usually the best strategy from a financial perspective.

[fiby41]

Both Analog and Digital Electronics subjects are compulsory for semester 3 so I don't have a choice.

[Sclass]

For me his depends on the device, who designed it and who made it.

I'd say a Scion is a very "digital" car. It feels like it is simple but I don't think its electronic control system is simple in any way. It just doesn't break. So we start thinking there's something simple about it.

My take is the car is engineered using sensible practices and manufactured using quality processes and components. A good friend of mine designs for Denso (Toyota's electronics vendor) and criticizes Mercedes design philosophy and construction techniques when it comes to their electronics.

It may have little to do with digital vs. analog. Or it may have a lot. If Mercedes engineers go wild with their digital systems the sky is he limit with unreliability. Code in the wrong hands is a dangerous thing.

Look at the difference between second hand Lexus prices versus Mercedes prices. There is something there. But it isn't Lexus simplicity or analog Lexi.

And it really all depends right? Is a Prius hybrid with all its connections and complexity more reliable than an analog ignition MG Midget? Sure is. I don't think there are hard and fast rules.

There are advantages to being able to change the dynamics of a design by just swapping a resistor or capacitor value in an analog circuit. You cannot hack DSP with a wire cutter and solder iron. This is especially true when it isn't your design and you don't have access to a feedback trim register buried deep in a microchip. It's not easy unless you can just disassemble the code and find that move instruction. Again it depends. I guess when it's my design that I control I prefer a digital system. If I have to trim another engineer's design I want analog.

That has an analog (har har ) to DIY stuff we fix at home.

I had a Maytag washer that I replaced the mechanical timer sequencer device on. Many machines use the same control regardless of make. So it is easy to pick up the part on eBay. My new LG has a custom board with microcode that does essentially the same thing but I'll have to go to the mother ship if it blows up. If it blows up. If it is designed well and made well the PCB and microcontroller should last longer than the washer motor. But was it? I can say the Maytag mechanical monstrosity wore out after a few thousand loads. Contacts, springs, D.C. Motor, gears etc. just don't run forever the same way unstressed (thermal/vibration) electronics does.

So it all depends. If a digital system is designed well, the digital part shouldn't break and require me to get in there and fix it. In a perfect world. Unfortunately it is hit and miss if you find stuff that is designed sensibly and manufactured using good practices and materials. We are at the mercy of the people who designed and assembled our machines. Amazon reviews ?

Perhaps digital systems empower engineers to go wild. Engineers gone wild.

Edit - being a late adopter is spot on. Let others take the beating and learn from their mistakes.