sugar daddies/sugar mammas

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thrifty++
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sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by thrifty++ » Sat Apr 15, 2017 8:52 pm

What do people think about using sugar daddies or sugar mamma's as another income stream? Someone was talking to me about the website seekingarrangements.com in a joking manner and I thought it was quite amusing but also kind of fascinating.

Has anyone done it? What do you think of it? And are sugar mammas realistically even a thing?

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C40
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by C40 » Sat Apr 15, 2017 9:39 pm

I've seen quite a few women on Tinder and Bumble say they are looking for a sugar daddy. Sometimes it seems entirely serious, and sometimes it seems they tried to write it in a way that they could claim it was a joke. I watched a (mediocre) documentary on the subject about a month ago. The feeling I got from the documentary is that there are way more young women wanting a sugar daddy than there are men wanting to be sugar daddies. So unless you are super attractive AND are willing to work hard enough at it to outperform the competition, it's probably not worth bothering with this as a potential income stream.

Sugar mammas are certainly a thing. There are WAY fewer than there are sugar daddies. I'd guess (only a guess) that for every 1,000 men who want or are willing to be a sugar daddy, there are maybe 5 women wanting to be a sugar mamma.

Even if there were good sugar momma prospects, I'm all but certain I wouldn't be interested. I could theoretically see myself being a prostitute, as that seems a lot simpler. But, to have an entire serious relationship with that kind of dynamic? No way. Maybe I'm wrong but I imagine that in nearly all sugar relationships there are a ton of mind games, sort of power plays, and attempts at manipulation.

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Ego
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by Ego » Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:08 pm

Zero experience, but my favorite writer did a story in GQ on it that is hilarious.

http://www.gq.com/story/sugar-daddies-explained

If you ask her if this is prostitution—I never once did with the women I interviewed; every time, they brought it up—she'll say the question is moot.
“I'm kind of pragmatic about the whole thing,” she says. She looks across the table at me, the dummy who had to reschedule on her twice because of all the work I juggle, who has spent far more time and energy writing this story than a commensurate amount of blow jobs would require.
For Tigress, the question is not whether she's a prostitute. It's whether the rest of us are idiots

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BRUTE
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by BRUTE » Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:55 pm

C40 wrote:
Sat Apr 15, 2017 9:39 pm
I could theoretically see myself being a prostitute
honesty. it's respectable.

Did
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by Did » Sun Apr 16, 2017 12:51 am

It's certainly real. Full of young women looking for a little sugar. If you have the cash, go for it.

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Eureka
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by Eureka » Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:02 am

My take is that unless I get real cash out of the arrangement (but then it is prostitution?), I would anytime prefer a job where I do get real money instead of dinners, flowers, dresses, theater tickets, jewelry, travels, and maybe rent paid.

IlliniDave
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by IlliniDave » Sun Apr 16, 2017 5:00 am

I often joke about finding a sugar momma but never had a serious thought on the matter. There are two reasons for that. One is that I would command less than minimum wage so would find things like bagging groceries far more lucrative. The other is that I'm just too independent-minded/introverted.

I'm getting to the age where I get looked at as a potential sugar daddy, or at least a de-facto one. A fair number of women I've run across are open about seeking an "established" man to take care of them, with the end game being (re)marriage. My superficial appearance belies my degree of establishment (though I have a job/profession that results in respectable income) and so I'm typically not told this as a form of proposition, more likely it's a technique to discourage me a priori. I expect there's an analogous dynamic where the gender roles are reversed, I just don't encounter it so can't speak anecdotally about it.

Especially once midlife rolls around, can't blame people for looking out for their future and being a little business-like in their partnership goals.

Scott 2
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by Scott 2 » Sun Apr 16, 2017 7:53 am

I thought this was going to be an answer to - what do you do in the 95% scenario when your investments outgrow your SWR.

Sure seems like the opposite of freedom to me.

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Dragline
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by Dragline » Sun Apr 16, 2017 8:46 am

Well, it's a transactional arrangement and "You get what you pay for." For however long you can pay.

It strikes me that most of these "solutions" to life are relatively short-term and fragile in nature due to the relatively flimsy basis for the relationship. On the other hand, you might be able to parlay the whole thing into becoming the FLOTUS.

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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Sun Apr 16, 2017 9:54 am

My sunglasses, my reading glasses, the upfront cost of my new phone, my bicycle, my hiking sandals, my coffee, my good gray wool coat, my flannel monkey pajamas... some stuff in the room where I am sitting that was purchased for me by a man I was dating. I am currently 52 years old, could stand to lose at least 27 lbs, and I have never been more than moderately pretty. I never date men that I do not consider to be attractive. I like brains enough for amusing conversation and a variety of "man-candy" attributes, and I do not tolerate rude behavior. So, I suppose my net "take" is representative of the slim margin just being female commands in freely negotiated contract.

The way my brain works is that I can't not integrate new information into my overall model. So, ever since I met a couple young girlfriend-experience escorts around 8 years ago, who informed then 44 year old me that I could command at least $250/hr on the GFE escort circuit, I have been compelled to tot up my dating "receipts" along with every other aspect of my lifestyle economics. The average single American man spends around $250/month on dating. The majority of men I date have incomes that are more than twice the average. I don't filter for income. It's just a matter of age and level of erudition. Not a single one of them has ever complained about the expense associated with dating me, because I am very easy-going and flexible, so mostly it is just that they have to buy a second ticket for me on whatever lifestyle they are buying for themselves, because nobody wants to live for free in my camper with me (sigh.)

Another interesting possibility to consider is that if you practice polyamory, you could be functioning as a "baby" in one relationship, and a "Daddy" or a "Mamma" in another relationship at the same time. Also, I would note that if you are a fit, attractive male, there is a much better market for ballroom dancing skills and/or escort-to-the-theater than there is for sex with the uber-wealthy older female crowd.

I thought the GQ article was amusing, but not entirely honest. Power dynamics and trade exist in all relationships, no matter how egalitarian. In our affluent society, few people are truly financially dependent on their partner. Other varieties of dependence can be much more subject to manipulation or result in more loss of freedom. For simple instance, all the notions and values attached to the phrase "father-of-my-children" kept me trapped and miserable in my otherwise egalitarian marriage for many years. My core fear being that my children would hate me if I dumped their Dad. Depending on the men I am currently dating to cover my entertainment and shoe (I do not know why they always buy me shoes) budget is a Grade E level power dynamic comparatively. I would wager that most people have similar ideals such as "true love", "happy family", "being a promise-keeper" that they would, and often do, pay through the nose to maintain.

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jennypenny
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by jennypenny » Sun Apr 16, 2017 10:00 am

I'm available if someone's looking for a sugar momma. PM me a current pic and list any special talents. :D

People bring a variety of resources and skill sets into a partnership as well as their unique needs and desires. I've stopped judging the criteria on which people base their relationships because I've seen too many 'good' partnerships fail and some surprising ones succeed.

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BRUTE
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by BRUTE » Sun Apr 16, 2017 10:07 am

jennypenny wrote:
Sun Apr 16, 2017 10:00 am
I'm available if someone's looking for a sugar momma. PM me a current pic and list any special talents. :D
---->

talents: can hold breath for a long time

FrugalFred
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by FrugalFred » Sun Apr 16, 2017 11:47 am

I'd totally be a sugar baby if there were actually some demand for average blokes. It's fun to imagine playing boy toy to generous Selma Hayek clones. In reality I'd be a renting out my orifices to some old queen for pennies.

As I become more financially secure I'll probably become a sugar daddy of sorts. A poster on here once said (for men) women are the fly in the ointment of ERE. I couldn't agree more.

classical_Liberal
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by classical_Liberal » Sun Apr 16, 2017 12:54 pm

Given my age, about half of my dates are single mothers ages late 20's to early 40's. My dating experiences seems to show single women with a younger child/children tend to noticeably "lower their standards" from a physical appearance and personality standpoint, if they deem me (or other males) as having good provider potential. This scales somewhat with the woman's attributes. I also think women tend to be slightly less focused on physical attributes than men in general (ie if men base 80% of attraction on looks, women base 65%). It seems to be a security in child-rearing thing; whether this is a biological, pragmatic, or social based phenomenon is outside the scope of my observations. I have noted that once the child/children reach mid-to-late teens this effect seems to diminish, although I have not yet dated past the ages of mid-40's, so perhaps the effect reemerges again later in life for other reasons such as providing a sense of adventure, etc.

If one considers the above a sugar daddy situation, then I would say it's very prevalent in out society, particular with single parent families. OTOH if the definition is the traditional sense of trophy wife/pool boy, then I would guess it's less prevalent than we assume given a such a strong cultural push towards "falling in love". Per usual my observations are US-centric.

From a systems flow standpoint, personally, I count dating as an expense in both time and money, essentially entertainment Benefits I received from dating are placed into the social capital category. Hence, I generally try to avoid burning bridges whenever possible. This is not to say I remain BFF's with women I have dated. However, if we parted on good terms there can still be a significant amount of social capital available. For example, the lawyer I dated for several months last year & I are still on friendly enough terms where I am certain she would provide me with very reduced cost legal services should I need them in the future. Does that mean she would be my sugar-mamma if I use that social capital? IDK?

slsdly
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by slsdly » Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:33 pm

Well, Mom always said she sees me with an older woman...

EdithKeeler
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by EdithKeeler » Sun Apr 16, 2017 10:25 pm

I have offered myself as a Sugar Mama to my boyfriend. We're currently in a long distance relationship and I offered it as enticement to move here. I advised he could live in my house for free and all he has to do is the yard work and keep the house reasonably tidy and take care of the dogs when I go on business trips. Should give him ample time to finish his novel.

Alas, he's not a young boy toy but older than me with his own money, so it's not enough enticement.

I thought it was a pretty good deal!

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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by ether » Sun Apr 16, 2017 11:44 pm

Oh boy! Nothing like monetizing human affection!

Did
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by Did » Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:41 am

@ether It sounds cold, like that. Certainly my wife's financial situation played no role in my choice of her as a partner - it rarely does for men. The opposite is not true no matter what women say (are they more likely to laugh at their bosses joke or the cleaners?).

7Wannabe5
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:18 am

@EdithKeeler: That sort of arrangement hardly ever works because human males are fairly territorial. So, they will either attempt to take dominance over your property by peeing around the perimeter, or they will do stuff like leave loaves of bread, bouquets of flowers, or dead animals on your front porch as they cycle in and out of the range in which you dwell which is not within their primary circle of dominance. On rare occasions, they will exhibit scant capability to co-operate, but I wouldn't rely on this on a regular basis. They will usually experience reduced testosterone levels, and sink into sullen resentment, and become incapable of sexual mounting behavior, if you offer them too much direct instruction, which it is difficult not to do, if you are together on that which you wish to remain your turf.

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BRUTE
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by BRUTE » Mon Apr 17, 2017 7:09 am

he might even attempt to buy some decorative pillows or a throw rug.

James_0011
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by James_0011 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:24 am

Im not sure if this counts, but I am in my twenties and have some kind of relationship with a woman twice my age. I wouldn't say that we are partners, but we have sex and spend time together. She lives on the other side of the world for some parts of the year, and pays for my plane ticket to fly and visit her, she also pays for my transportation and food when I visit, and of course I stay with her for free. She also buys me presents/gifts all the time.

So, its not really a sugar momma situation since she doesn't give me straight cash, but its close.

7Wannabe5
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 2:47 pm

@BRUTE: Exactly.

Jean
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by Jean » Mon Apr 17, 2017 4:21 pm

Or he might build a hut in the forest nearby and claim to live there instead of your place.

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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by enigmaT120 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:07 pm

Peeing around the perimeter is great. 32 acres = I drink a lot of water.

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Sclass
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Re: sugar daddies/sugar mammas

Post by Sclass » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:01 pm

These relationships can get very demanding as time goes on.

Replies have pretty much said this.

My advice for the babies, think about the future.

My advice for the mommas and daddys, think about the future.

My extended family is polluted by these long term dalliances. Rent to own is a bad option IMHO. Things are very complicated now for me and my half siblings.

THe men in my family who do this have it down to a science. It's like employment. If you pay too much they will leave. If you pay too little they'll leave. They have played it that way till the eve of their deaths. Now we have a bunch of nervous hang arounds trying to jockey for "guarantees ". It's sick.

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