Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
There are some advantages to having a high net worth, higher than you need for retirement, even if you don't intend to spend it.
- Accredited investors have more (though not necessarily better) investment opportunities
- Able to implement a riskier / less diversified / more passive portfolio without worrying about big drawdowns
- Vanguard and others offer lower fees and personalized services if you have a high enough amount invested
- Some banks offer higher savings rates if you have more in your account
- Greater feeling of security
These may not be big advantages, but hey better than nothing. Are there other rich people benefits that can be "unlocked" once you hit a magic round number in your account balance or net worth?
- Accredited investors have more (though not necessarily better) investment opportunities
- Able to implement a riskier / less diversified / more passive portfolio without worrying about big drawdowns
- Vanguard and others offer lower fees and personalized services if you have a high enough amount invested
- Some banks offer higher savings rates if you have more in your account
- Greater feeling of security
These may not be big advantages, but hey better than nothing. Are there other rich people benefits that can be "unlocked" once you hit a magic round number in your account balance or net worth?
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
Self insure a lot of physical stuff. Liability insurance would probably need to go up though.
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
Bribery, in the legal sense e.g political donations.
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
Interactive Brokers gives you extremely low trading and borrowing/margin costs.
Banks fawn all over you with "private banking", multiple free accounts, credit lines and personal service.
Every investment advisor wants to buy you a free dinner so they can pitch you -- oh wait, that part sucks.
When something significant breaks (a roof, an HVAC system, a car), you can just write a check and get another one if you still need one.
You can be extravagantly generous or kind on a whim. And not tell anyone else about it.
Banks fawn all over you with "private banking", multiple free accounts, credit lines and personal service.
Every investment advisor wants to buy you a free dinner so they can pitch you -- oh wait, that part sucks.
When something significant breaks (a roof, an HVAC system, a car), you can just write a check and get another one if you still need one.
You can be extravagantly generous or kind on a whim. And not tell anyone else about it.
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
Every item listed above, except for OP's and Dragline's very last ones, simply serve to increase a net worth that was already higher than needed:)
-
- Site Admin
- Posts: 15996
- Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:38 pm
- Location: USA, Zone 5b, Koppen Dfa, Elev. 620ft, Walkscore 77
- Contact:
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
It becomes significantly easier to allocate that networth appropriately, because the need of assets that need to be converted to reallocate becomes relatively smaller.
Examples:
You might not have to worry about 72(t).
You might be able to treat your house as a trade-able investment and not something you're stuck with lest you have to dig into complicated accounts.
You can disburse income sources for complete tax-optimization, e.g. live on qualified dividends while deducting most of your income with various tax moves.
You have more dry-powder, because why not.
Examples:
You might not have to worry about 72(t).
You might be able to treat your house as a trade-able investment and not something you're stuck with lest you have to dig into complicated accounts.
You can disburse income sources for complete tax-optimization, e.g. live on qualified dividends while deducting most of your income with various tax moves.
You have more dry-powder, because why not.
-
- Posts: 3876
- Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
You have more flexibility in supporting charities/causes and the like (while alive or as legacy).
You are able to do more to help family and friends if you choose to do so (while alive or as legacy).
If you wind up divorced and lose half you might still be okay.
You are able to do more to help family and friends if you choose to do so (while alive or as legacy).
If you wind up divorced and lose half you might still be okay.
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
Great reasons.
I can only add, increased factor of safety. Downturns can really expose the weak.
Maybe more choices?
I can only add, increased factor of safety. Downturns can really expose the weak.
Maybe more choices?
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
I was listening to a photography podcast the other day. It wasn't about money but the interviewee mentioned growing up with a rich father. He described problems related to the money, but he also said that his father could use money to prevent (certain) problems from ever occurring.
-
- Posts: 123
- Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2011 8:55 pm
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
One very useful one is that you can take risks that someone without a high net worth can not take. And as some well known investors have said, investors are almost always overcompensated for taking risk.
This is especially true as your withdraw rate drops to under 1% or under .5%. At these levels (based on the past statistic of a 4% SWR) you only need 12% to 25% of your net worth to fund your expenses, which means you can have a higher risk tolerance than someone who needs a 4% withdrawal rate to fund their expenses. And an immeasurably higher tolerance to risk than someone whom needs their entire net worth to make their next rent payment.
Consider the person who needs their net worth to make their next rent payment is generally limited to investing it in a bank account earning less than 1%. While the person who has a withdrawal rate of 4% generally finds their risk tolerance allows them to invest their net worth in a mixture of stocks and bonds, historically yielding around 7%. In contrast the person who has 1% withdrawal rate might find they can tolerate the risk of running 100% equities (when the equities markets are not overvalued), which historically yields 11%.
Further the person with a .5% withdrawal rate might also be in 100% equities but also borrowing a bit (nothing that would cause their withdrawal rate to go above 1% even if they loss it all, which is unlikely) on a 1% annual interest margin loan (as Dragline alluded to). And using the margin money to buy real estate that people want to sell quickly and turning around and reselling for a 10% or 20% profit or buying undervalued equity options or running various mean reversion strategies in the financial markets or doing any number of things that on average make goods levels of returns (usually above that of equities) but require higher levels of risk tolerance and higher levels of free capital to do profitably.
This is especially true as your withdraw rate drops to under 1% or under .5%. At these levels (based on the past statistic of a 4% SWR) you only need 12% to 25% of your net worth to fund your expenses, which means you can have a higher risk tolerance than someone who needs a 4% withdrawal rate to fund their expenses. And an immeasurably higher tolerance to risk than someone whom needs their entire net worth to make their next rent payment.
Consider the person who needs their net worth to make their next rent payment is generally limited to investing it in a bank account earning less than 1%. While the person who has a withdrawal rate of 4% generally finds their risk tolerance allows them to invest their net worth in a mixture of stocks and bonds, historically yielding around 7%. In contrast the person who has 1% withdrawal rate might find they can tolerate the risk of running 100% equities (when the equities markets are not overvalued), which historically yields 11%.
Further the person with a .5% withdrawal rate might also be in 100% equities but also borrowing a bit (nothing that would cause their withdrawal rate to go above 1% even if they loss it all, which is unlikely) on a 1% annual interest margin loan (as Dragline alluded to). And using the margin money to buy real estate that people want to sell quickly and turning around and reselling for a 10% or 20% profit or buying undervalued equity options or running various mean reversion strategies in the financial markets or doing any number of things that on average make goods levels of returns (usually above that of equities) but require higher levels of risk tolerance and higher levels of free capital to do profitably.
-
- Posts: 123
- Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2011 8:55 pm
-
- Posts: 5406
- Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:28 am
- Location: Wettest corner of Orygun
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
This can be a persuasive concept when dealing with people who have no interest in investing, the people who have the "I don't want to take a risk, I can't tolerate losing money" mentality. However, for ERE folks, savings rate is so much more important that we shouldn't need to go there.A Life of FI wrote:Consider the person who needs their net worth to make their next rent payment is generally limited to investing it in a bank account earning less than 1%. While the person who has a withdrawal rate of 4% generally finds their risk tolerance allows them to invest their net worth in a mixture of stocks and bonds, historically yielding around 7%. In contrast the person who has 1% withdrawal rate might find they can tolerate the risk of running 100% equities (when the equities markets are not overvalued), which historically yields 11%.
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
Not sure if the OP meant to include ERE'ers who are financially independent (or near it) in the verbiage "high net worth", but...
As my net worth has increased (and approaches the "fu-money"/financial-independence threshold), my mind has been gradually changing about how I think about things. About a lot of things, finance related, and otherwise. It is not easy for me to describe precisely, though. I guess one of the biggest things is, I feel like I am empowered to make better decisions about things... about everything in life. I never feel rushed, and feel like I have the ability to make the best decision in any given circumstance. I don't feel cornered into anything... It is hard to quantify, really.
As my net worth has increased (and approaches the "fu-money"/financial-independence threshold), my mind has been gradually changing about how I think about things. About a lot of things, finance related, and otherwise. It is not easy for me to describe precisely, though. I guess one of the biggest things is, I feel like I am empowered to make better decisions about things... about everything in life. I never feel rushed, and feel like I have the ability to make the best decision in any given circumstance. I don't feel cornered into anything... It is hard to quantify, really.
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
Better access to information. Secret handshake. Cool t-shirt.
Of course, you can get some of the same benefits just by achieving one degree of sexual/social separation from those with very high net worth due to the flow referred to by some as braggadocio.
Of course, you can get some of the same benefits just by achieving one degree of sexual/social separation from those with very high net worth due to the flow referred to by some as braggadocio.
-
- Site Admin
- Posts: 15996
- Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:38 pm
- Location: USA, Zone 5b, Koppen Dfa, Elev. 620ft, Walkscore 77
- Contact:
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
I just remembered the one advantage that would have instantly solved a once much complained objection:
"When anyone asks about how you were able to RE, you can just say you're a millionaire."
No longer any need to go into elaborate definitions of SWR, investing, passive income, budgeting, ...
"When anyone asks about how you were able to RE, you can just say you're a millionaire."
No longer any need to go into elaborate definitions of SWR, investing, passive income, budgeting, ...
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
Yes! Connections can be bought or earned.7Wannabe5 wrote:Better access to information. Secret handshake. Cool t-shirt.
Of course, you can get some of the same benefits just by achieving one degree of sexual/social separation from those with very high net worth due to the flow referred to by some as braggadocio.
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
I think it gives you more negotiating power with almost any transaction.
- confidence to charge high prices for consulting services and know you can walk away and not care if they dont agree
- charge high sale prices on items and being able to confidently stay the course, eg selling a property
- command pay rises confidently
- Negotiate large periods of time off work
I think with every negotiation if you are the person who is genuinely happy to walk away from the deal you have significant bargaining power. This helps to get the best for you out of the deal especially when you come across very confident. Its like dating. The hard to get factor. I have certainly noticed my negotiating power in transactions rise as my wealth has.
- confidence to charge high prices for consulting services and know you can walk away and not care if they dont agree
- charge high sale prices on items and being able to confidently stay the course, eg selling a property
- command pay rises confidently
- Negotiate large periods of time off work
I think with every negotiation if you are the person who is genuinely happy to walk away from the deal you have significant bargaining power. This helps to get the best for you out of the deal especially when you come across very confident. Its like dating. The hard to get factor. I have certainly noticed my negotiating power in transactions rise as my wealth has.
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
This is the "Plato's Cave" analogy that jacob uses in the book (The First Book of Jacob or the "FBJ" ).chicago81 wrote:Not sure if the OP meant to include ERE'ers who are financially independent (or near it) in the verbiage "high net worth", but...
As my net worth has increased (and approaches the "fu-money"/financial-independence threshold), my mind has been gradually changing about how I think about things. About a lot of things, finance related, and otherwise. It is not easy for me to describe precisely, though. I guess one of the biggest things is, I feel like I am empowered to make better decisions about things... about everything in life. I never feel rushed, and feel like I have the ability to make the best decision in any given circumstance. I don't feel cornered into anything... It is hard to quantify, really.
What came to me in the shower this morning is that its also like seeing most other people in your life walking upstream in a river, while you have gotten out of the river and either walk along the bank or sometimes just sit there and contemplate or appreciate things. While other people are often trying to avoid the debris coming at them, having to make quick decisions, you have the luxury of ruminating and making more calculated or reasoned choices.
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
I have a reasonably high net worth now. I think it's good because as per chicago's comment your outlook changes a bit.
I'm still turning up to work though and it's becoming harder and harder to do because I don't give a shit.
I'm still turning up to work though and it's becoming harder and harder to do because I don't give a shit.
Re: Advantages to having high net worth, aside from spending it
jacob wrote: "When anyone asks about how you were able to RE, you can just say you're a millionaire."
..
I've actually tried this. I am not sure what was worse. Being questioned, or being called a liar in varied levels of politeness.
By my friends.
I lost a lot of friends.