Brexit
Re: Brexit
Higher population density is an advantage when it comes to the environment. It makes walking, public transport and cycling more viable. Compare a typical compact UK/European town/city to a North American town/city.
Also, heavily populated countries can be self-sufficient in food. Look at the Netherlands, more densely populated than the UK. They are massive food exporters.
Yes, fewer people is good for the environment, but if you are serious about that, have fewer children. If you assume a fixed world population, it is more environmentally friendly to have them crammed next to each other rather than spread across a wide area.
Also, heavily populated countries can be self-sufficient in food. Look at the Netherlands, more densely populated than the UK. They are massive food exporters.
Yes, fewer people is good for the environment, but if you are serious about that, have fewer children. If you assume a fixed world population, it is more environmentally friendly to have them crammed next to each other rather than spread across a wide area.
Re: Brexit
I see where you are coming from BUT...radamfi wrote:If you assume a fixed world population, it is more environmentally friendly to have them crammed next to each other rather than spread across a wide area.
It may make sense to dump your toxic waste all in one place but I would argue for human footprint, human's widely dispersed practising permaculture principles outside of urban environments may well have significantly less footprint on the environment than urban dwellers who are ignorant of their arguably larger demands on the earth's ecology. i.e. Outsourcing food production to the industrialised intensive mono-agriculture farming techniques which work against nature, not with it. A permaculture food garden can actively encourage and balances other life, whereas green revolution style agri actually suppresses it.
Of course, there are advantaged to living in towns and cities which cannot be ignored. Were going off on a tangent now
Re: Brexit
Part of our food export is first imported into the Netherlands, then processed or repackaged in the NL, then shipped out again. We're good at trading in the Netherlands.radamfi wrote: Also, heavily populated countries can be self-sufficient in food. Look at the Netherlands, more densely populated than the UK. They are massive food exporters.
There is a lot of food production, too, that's correct. There's lots of intensive animal farming - which is not very good for the animals, nor for the environment, and perhaps also not for our health (think zoonoses and bacteria that become resistant to antibiotics). A second thing is that we have a lot of greenhouses. Also not very environmentally-friendly, because they need a lot of energy in these parts of the world.
In short, I don't think you should look at us for some sustainable answers.
Re: Brexit
Flowers, indeed. I've met some Dutch farmers who now grow their flowers in Africa (cheap labor, lots of sun) and then have them transported to the Netherlands for processing & selling.
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Re: Brexit
Visiting the flower markets in the Netherlands was fascinating, the scale is enormous.
Re: Brexit
My premature death is one step closer.
Re: Brexit
because of flowers?radamfi wrote:My premature death is one step closer.
Re: Brexit
Because of last night's vote.BRUTE wrote:because of flowers?radamfi wrote:My premature death is one step closer.
Re: Brexit
I don't see a hard brexit being geographically achievable in the long term; it would a require a hard border in Northern Ireland - highly contentious- or some kind of internal border along the Irish Sea, which is somewhat absurd.
We could just join the EFTA; which would be a workable compromise: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europea ... ssociation
We could just join the EFTA; which would be a workable compromise: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europea ... ssociation
Re: Brexit
Logic doesn't apply any more.chenda wrote:I don't see a hard brexit being geographically achievable in the long term; it would a require a hard border in Northern Ireland - highly contentious- or some kind of internal border along the Irish Sea, which is somewhat absurd.
We could just join the EFTA; which would be a workable compromise: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europea ... ssociation
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Re: Brexit
Totally true, I have met these Dutch farmers in Kenya, and they are happy there, less regulation than Europe, cheap labor, enough water and sun, and daily flower flights to the Netherlands. The world is more and more connected, although a reverse has started with Brexit and Trump towards "own country first" attitude. Can we really reset the world towards the previous level of trade interactions, and become less connected and hide behind walls (economic walls and real brick walls) .... As long as economy grows, perhaps, but once we hit another crisis, the flood of poor people towards the west will increase (especially Europe), it will be impossible to stop. For instance, I have seen the growth of population in Nigeria (total population will double the coming 20-30 years towards 350 Million), and they cannot even sustain themselves right now. 3 times guessing where they will go to if they are hungry. I think the only way is to enhance our global connectiveness instead of hiding behind walls, and make sure the whole world can benefit, not just "own country first". It will backfire sooner or later if we think Brexit (and similar elsewhere) is the answerDutchGirl wrote:Flowers, indeed. I've met some Dutch farmers who now grow their flowers in Africa (cheap labor, lots of sun) and then have them transported to the Netherlands for processing & selling.
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Re: Brexit
I'm just resigned to it happening now and I'm not expecting any trade deal with the EU for at least 10 years.radamfi wrote:Logic doesn't apply any more.
Re: Brexit
My suicide is now just over one and a half years away
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40734504
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40734504
Re: Brexit
I do feel sorry for you, but hey, you don't have to stay there. You can always leave. What about migrating to the Netherlands?
Re: Brexit
or, as other humans have called it, progress.
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Re: Brexit
It's certainly the frugal option.
Re: Brexit
Does this change affect you if you are already in the UK? I'm asking because my partner is also not a UK citizen.As explained earlier, leaving now is not practical.