Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Health, Fitness, Food, Insurance, Longevity, Diets,...
Post Reply
Arbo
Posts: 76
Joined: Sat Jul 27, 2013 11:40 pm

Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by Arbo »

I am wondering if there is any proven harm to consuming lots of vegetable oil -- I know that it's 'unhealthy' because of the calories, but I mean what the 'health' people tend to say about it, i.e. paleo people, omega 6's/clog arteries etc

I don't want to do the experiment on myself, but if vegetable oil is basically harmless and safe, then I can drop my food budget very very low(have a huge gallon of vegetable oil that I bought from Walmart, along with 40lbs of rice/50lbs of flour etc,)

I'm just trying to cut my expenses on the only thing I know I can, food, while I try to get back into looking for a job, but curious and worrieda bout this vegetable oil thing

(before anyone says Butter, butter is like 10x as expensive as oil)

(someone please tell me that it's basically healthy/the same as other fats, so I can save more money on food)

(this is GhettoErasmus obviously.. lol, disliked that name for a few reasons, though people on here seemed to like it)

jacob
Site Admin
Posts: 15907
Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:38 pm
Location: USA, Zone 5b, Koppen Dfa, Elev. 620ft, Walkscore 77
Contact:

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by jacob »

It's certainly healthier than most animal sourced alternatives, e.g. butter, lard, ghee, ... Olive oil is the standard go to. Use it for cooking. Even eating a tablespoon or two per day is supposed to be very good for you. If you start drinking a cup of it or pouring it on everything, you'll probably end up with diarrhea.

In short; don't use it as a cheap source of calories. But definitely don't be afraid of it either. If you want to experience "dangerous eating", it's usually---generalizing heavily here---dairy products and processed meats that are unhealthy.

cmonkey
Posts: 1814
Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2014 11:56 am

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by cmonkey »

We used to go with olive oil but switched to coconut oil simply for the less "oily" nature of what we make. Maybe it was because we bought the heavy/cheap stuff but it really was that bad. Bottom of the barrel looking as well. Coconut oil gives a nice clean taste to everything (particularly popcorn, its very crisp!). Plus its so expensive it prompts us to be more conservative with it so we are eating less.

Did
Posts: 693
Joined: Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:50 am

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by Did »

Cf Jacob current thinking is some vegetable oils are less healthy than animal fats. See http://www.smh.com.au/national/health/c ... ktips.html

jacob
Site Admin
Posts: 15907
Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:38 pm
Location: USA, Zone 5b, Koppen Dfa, Elev. 620ft, Walkscore 77
Contact:

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by jacob »

I actually took out a line wrt the carciogenic effects. Different oils have different smoke-points. If used for frying and the oil starts smoking, toss the oil, and start over.

ThisDinosaur
Posts: 997
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2015 9:31 am

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by ThisDinosaur »

Tim Ferris asked this question once. It turns out that the origin of the idea that olive oil is good for you is based on research comparing it to cooking with butter. Butter has more saturated fat than vegetable oil, but there are other sources of fat that have less or even no saturated fat. So, yes, if you need to cook with grease, olive oil is better than butter, and canola oil is even better still. If you can cook without adding greasy fats, that would presumably be healthiest.

Veggie oils are made by heating seeds in a petroleum hexane solvent, crushing them, and then using an acid bath to dissolve solid wax.

Arbo
Posts: 76
Joined: Sat Jul 27, 2013 11:40 pm

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by Arbo »

jacob wrote:It's certainly healthier than most animal sourced alternatives, e.g. butter, lard, ghee, ... Olive oil is the standard go to. Use it for cooking. Even eating a tablespoon or two per day is supposed to be very good for you. If you start drinking a cup of it or pouring it on everything, you'll probably end up with diarrhea.

In short; don't use it as a cheap source of calories. But definitely don't be afraid of it either. If you want to experience "dangerous eating", it's usually---generalizing heavily here---dairy products and processed meats that are unhealthy.
I've heard Olive oil isn't so bad for you, but what about Soybean Oil? That's what I have, and it seems to be the cheapest cooking oil

vexed87
Posts: 1521
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 8:02 am
Location: Yorkshire, UK

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by vexed87 »

Saturated fat arguments aside, smoke point is key when it comes to choosing the right fats for your recipes.
http://jonbarron.org/diet-and-nutrition ... kRfJdyx424

Virgin olive oil is terrible for roasting and frying because of it's low smoke point, where as a refined olive oil would fair better, but there are cheaper alternatives with higher smoke points. Virgin olive oil is suitable for adding to salads dressings etc, but if you fry/roast with it, it tarnishes the taste of food as it 'burns' at high temperatures.

Try compare two oils heated on the hob, say virgin olive vs canola - heat both at the same temperature at the same time, note how the virgin olive oil darkens just before it starts to smoke. Ideally you don't want any smoke when cooking with oils to avoid the carinogenic effects and tainting the taste of your food.

Therefore, I use olive oil when baking bread, making salad dressings etc, for everything else I use either refined olive oil, canola oil, or veg oil.

User avatar
Sclass
Posts: 2791
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:15 pm
Location: Orange County, CA

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by Sclass »

ThisDinosaur wrote: Veggie oils are made by heating seeds in a petroleum hexane solvent, crushing them, and then using an acid bath to dissolve solid wax.
:shock: :shock: :shock:

I've been to many oil pressing operations in quest to find biodiesel feedstock. I've never seen solvent treatment or acid baths. I did have a colleague who was a food chemist who said big companies like ADM put a lot of effort into making their oils clear at cool temperatures.

I think this is what you're talking about. I've noticed cheaper peanut oils from smaller names have a higher cloud point. I always equated this to low end peanut oil but now you got me thinking I've got it backwards.

Thanks for the heads up. It actually makes sense. The guys I checked out were small timers pressing seeds for high end grape seed oils.

OP - why does buying oil save money on food? Just curious. I thought food oil was a pretty luxurious thing throughout history. Isn't it cheaper to eat the entire seed, bean, avocado etc. than just the oil? Reminds me, I am having roasted garlic cloves today....mmmmm.

Soy oil is the cheapest, especially ADM. But isn't it cheaper and healthier just to eat soy beans like edamame? The mountain of beans needed to make a 35lb jug of soy oil is scary. I'm missing something here.

ThisDinosaur
Posts: 997
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2015 9:31 am

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by ThisDinosaur »

Sclass, where were these pressing operations you visited?

I left out the fact that "Virgin" Olive Oil is supposedly produced using mechanical means only. Meaning they press, grind, and filter the olive juice without adding solvents other than water. But the USDA busted some imported varieties for cutting with some produced through chemical processing, and oils from other plants like Sunflower and Soybean oils. "Extra Virgin" Olive oil is the same, but also satisfies a chemical test of low acidity and higher quality/less rancid oil. That designation usually depends on the health of the plant and the weather conditions.

Arbo, Vegetable Oil goes bad eventually, so check the expiration date on that gallon of veggie oil. Gross microbes really love living in liquid, room temperature, fat. If you consume that stuff after its rancid, your dietary Omega 6 ratio will be the least of your concerns. The huge bag of rice and flour, though, should be good for a while and offer surprisingly good nutrition. Five cups of wheat flour a day supplies all of your daily required calories and DRV of protein. Both rice and flour are low in Lysine and fat soluble vitamins. Just get a cheap multivitamin and some dairy every day and you can cover those.

vexed87
Posts: 1521
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 8:02 am
Location: Yorkshire, UK

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by vexed87 »

Five cups of wheat flour a day supplies all of your daily required calories and DRV of protein.
Are you referring to this TheDinosaur? ;)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gruel

ThisDinosaur
Posts: 997
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2015 9:31 am

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by ThisDinosaur »

I was referring to this:
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/cer ... sta/5744/2
and the standard recommendation of 2000 Calorie diet with at least 50g of protein.

Ive never actually sat and eaten wheat flour or gruel. That wikipedia link implies Dickens was responsible for making english speakers avoid it; associating it with poor people and starvation. Or maybe its just that the word "gruel" really does sound unappetizing.

vexed87
Posts: 1521
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 8:02 am
Location: Yorkshire, UK

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by vexed87 »

Yep, vivid memories of trying it in school after watching oliver twist... :D Its basic survival food. I personally couldn't eat it unless there was no alternative, though I do enjoy porridge for breakfast (no quite the same though!)

I had no idea whole wheatflour had so much protein, I'll definitely be eating more of it from now on! I've been making more effort to bake brown breads lately. Thanks for sharing the link.

jacob
Site Admin
Posts: 15907
Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:38 pm
Location: USA, Zone 5b, Koppen Dfa, Elev. 620ft, Walkscore 77
Contact:

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by jacob »

Here's a recipe for gruel... never tried making it.

It looks like the "Maizena" (corn based gruel?) my parents occasionally inflicted on us when we were kids. Probably as some kind of experimental try-everything-once/don't-be-picky character building exercise. Or maybe this was just thought to be healthy in the late 1970s. Hmmm from the looks of it, one could do worse.

llorona
Posts: 444
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 11:44 pm
Location: SF Bay Area

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by llorona »

Ah, gruel. I grew up eating the Chinese version, which is made from rice and called "jook" or "congee." Filling, cheap, comforting, and quite tasty when soy sauce and meat or pickled vegetables are added to it.

User avatar
Sclass
Posts: 2791
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:15 pm
Location: Orange County, CA

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by Sclass »

ThisDinosaur wrote:Sclass, where were these pressing operations you visited?
.
In northern CA wine country. They used some kind of grinding machine that looked like a screw pump. A cake of greasy husks came out one side and liquid came out the other. Honestly they could have been doing chemical processing in there and not showing it to me. They were marketing the oils as healthy so it would have been in their interests to hide that part of the process.

It turned out the oil was too expensive for my needs. I ended up using discarded oil which was an even scarier unregulated world.

Chad
Posts: 3844
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 3:10 pm

Re: Is Vegetable Oil healthy?

Post by Chad »

Some more information from "the always something wrong with the study" health studies.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/12/health/ve ... index.html

Post Reply