The very same software - tools development and ERE

Anything to do with the traditional world of get a degree, get a job as well as its alternatives
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simplex
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The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by simplex »

Seth Godin, a marketeer turned thinker, sometimes has some great observations:

http://sethgodin.typepad.com/seths_blog ... tware.html

Basically he says, at the moment you can use the same software tools as the most advanced organizations. Using the same tools was not usual during earlier times. I still remember that premium compilers and software development systems were prohibitively expensive.

How long is this situation here to stay?
On the other hand, the tools are free, but the mental effort to use them is high!

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fiby41
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by fiby41 »

I've read his books about 3 years ago. Above post is too idealist to be true.

There are three types of careers:

High risk-high reward
Low risk-low reward
Something else, but I forgot

Example:
In online publishing, you don't become popular for having the best product. A minimum viable product MVP is made and all effort goes in promotion.
You may type like Seth Godin but you aren't going anywhere without his Stanford tag to get him noticed when starting out.

Maybe after FI, but for FI or anything requiring consistency... better to be the dentist who makes it to liberation regardless of hundred births.

daylen
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by daylen »

Some the the most efficient and functional (if you learn to use them) software tools were made long ago and are free to use. I posted this trilemma on the other form for software, choose 2: functionality, efficiency, or user friendliness. By user friendly I mean gradual learning curve.

Most of the work that is put into software these days just builds on these early tools to create more user friendly tools that are less efficient or less functional.

Scott 2
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by Scott 2 »

Written by someone ignorant of the tools used in industry :lol:

BRUTE
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by BRUTE »

brute is with fiby41 on this one. seth godin isn't successful because he's making quality product with good tools. he's successful because he's seth godin. it's 95% marketing, and the most effective marketing is scamming humans who are looking for a guru or leader to believe in. in fact, for this, the level of quality usually has to be lowered.

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Ego
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by Ego »

Tools are important. So is raw material. Everyone has access to the tools, which causes the value of the raw material to increase and get hoarded.

Big data.

simplex
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by simplex »

As I read the article, it is not about the success of Seth Godin, nor about what tools he uses. He even writes: "Of course, we haven't democratized access to closed off circles, we haven't changed the inherent and unstated biases of those in traditional seats in power."

It is the observation that you can use the same software development platforms like google (Go, App Engine, mapreduce, tensor flow), Facebook (their own PHP runtime), and others (Ruby on Rails). This is mostly true in web development, but not in e.g. semiconductor simulation.

Having the option to use a tool, and making good use of the tool is not necessarily correlated. Some of the tools are quite complex.

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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by jacob »

Uhm, yay?!

The problem with such a simplification is that the end-product doesn't depend on just the tool but also the user. In particular, where does the tool end and the tool-user begin? To which degree is the tool just an extension of the user. Give two people the same gun and I guarantee they won't be shooting equally well.

The same kind of thinking is observed in the idea that if we give everybody an education, then everybody will be smarter as if education is something you can give or purchase or _have_. It is not. Education is not a "has-a" property. It's an "is-a" property.

Another example are the economists, typically, who think that libraries substitute for resources or even people. Here the idea is simply that you can give anyone access to a research library, and boom, they'll be instant experts. Of course, that's not how reality works. So much knowledge remains unwritten. There's a big difference between information and knowledge.

In the same way, there's a difference between tools and tool-use.

In particular, while anyone has access to wordpress, only a few people have the income to get good at writing pithy blog posts. It's the skill that's the real limiter, not the availability of the tool.

simplex
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by simplex »

@jacob: I beg to differ. It's a combination of skill and tool you need.
Take your example of "Give two people the same gun and I guarantee they won't be shooting equally well."
True, but if one person only has a stick, and the other a gun, it will probably turn out different, even if the better shooter has the stick.

So, in some areas the easy access to tools allows newcomers to easier enter a market. But to succeed you need more.

JamesR
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by JamesR »

What about data?

Do you have access to the same tools (most, except for proprietary tech) and the same data (not likely) as google?

Organizations still maintain a competitive edge over individuals, even if most of the tools are available to all.

KevinW
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by KevinW »

JamesR wrote:What about data?
+1

My counterpoint to Godin is that the means of production involve more than just a laptop and desktop software.

The trend of technology is that, over time, more and more advanced technology becomes commoditized and democratized. In 1900 anyone could have hand tools but electricity was capital-intensive. In the 1960s anyone could have electricity, telephones, automobiles, and refrigeration, but computers and networks were capital-intensive. In the 2010s anyone can have computers, the Internet, and software, but usable big data sets and manufacturing facilities are capital-intensive.

This is a great thing for human progress. It's wonderful that someone at the US poverty level of income has the means to create something like a newspaper (blog), book (LaTeX and Lulu), TV show (Youtube), software (Linux tools), and so on. It's particularly exciting that people outside the first and second worlds can now express themselves on the global stage.

But, note that these markets (newspaper, book, TV show, software) are already mature. Regular folks don't have the same tools as companies that are inventing new categories of things. We don't have the semiconductor plants needed to make iPhones, or the datasets needed to make self-driving car AI, or the Gigafactory need to make Tesla cars.

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fiby41
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by fiby41 »

fiby41 wrote:
Mon Jul 25, 2016 8:40 am
There are three types of careers:

High risk-high reward
Low risk-low reward
Something else, but I forgot
Now that I remember, the third kind is rockstar type careers. These are different from the high risk high reward type because reward is not linked to effort at all.
Sure there is minimum requirement of effort, which acts as barrier to entry, but after that your fate is up to unknown influences that determine your popularity. It's very hard to break even.

Such careers are better left for after FI, or have n years of saving, make it before n years or go back to work. As there is a high time commitment required to be mediocre at it.

Example, singer, musicians, blogger, youtube content creation, authour, politician, privately funded landing on moon,...

slowtraveler
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by slowtraveler »

I agree with Jacob but I'll add that anyone can develop the skills and learn to use the tools while even finding similarly interested communities (like this one) so this is a huge opportunity.

Seamus
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by Seamus »

"...just about any industry."

What about software for designing physical products, especially complex ones (cars/airplanes/bridges etc)? Even in the 21st century, I'd still say designing/manufacturing goods is a pretty huge chunk of "industry." Licenses for professional grade CAD/CAM and finite element analysis software, which would be absolutely required for any of the products I listed above, run into the tens of thousands of dollars per license.

Am I missing his point?

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TheWanderingScholar
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Re: The very same software - tools development and ERE

Post by TheWanderingScholar »

Seamus wrote:
Sat Jul 22, 2017 2:07 pm
snip
Agreed. In the GIS Industry, while more smaller NGOs, countries, and companies are using QGIS are main GIS software as it is well, free, many medium to large size companies use ArcGIS for it's support line and help, and built in system for multiple situations, which QGIS does not offer and requires supplementary software.

The only real big companies I imagine using free-software are those enought in which diverting some resource to making software forks using open software like QGIS to make custom built systems for collection, input, management, and the analysis, for their needs.

Source:
Chat Between Me and my boss, a former software engineer during the 90s IIRC.

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