Customers who bought this book also bought ... the 4HWW

Questions and comments
jacob
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Post by jacob »

is up now for my book. I find these lists interesting for almost any product.
One of the books on the list is the 4HWW. Compare and contrast? I think we have the same attitude towards life (it's an adventure), but our methods, ethics, and general attitude towards other people are completely different.


S
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Post by S »

I borrowed 4HWW when it came out a while back and read the blog occasionally. I think it's just another method to achieve the same goal. Basically, he advocates starting a business you can put mostly on autopilot to produce income while you suggest saving a big pile of money to invest for income. I think he also is focused on getting a larger passive income for travel and other expensive endeavors, while you encourage frugality and enjoying the simple joys of life. Either way, the end goal is freedom from working for that income daily.
I'd be interested to see what the personality types are over at the 4HWW blog... I suspect what's going on is that the crowd tends toward "E" types who are interested in FI.


jacob
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Post by jacob »

I agree on the personality assessment. I suspect that Tim is an ENTJ.


photoguy
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Post by photoguy »

I tried reading the 4hww but got completely turned off by the authors narcississtic attitude and lack of ethics. Plus I suspect that much of what he writes has been highly embellished.


NYC ERE
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Post by NYC ERE »

I think there are some valuable bits of wisdom floating in Ferriss's pool of snake oil:
* wealth ≠ mansions/bling

* passive income > working for money

* the traditional workday is filled with inefficiency

* travel can be surprisingly affordable
The snake oil:
* a very mercenary attitude towards income generation (get a product, sell it), no discussion of providing real value -- this shouldn't be a surprise, given that his bread and butter was a dubious "fitness" supplement

* equates cheating at a professional sport with being a champion

* advocates "becoming an expert" in order to sell "information products"


AlexOliver
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Post by AlexOliver »

Anytime I hear read about creating "informaton products" (or worse-- "infoproducts") I stop reading.


Josh
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Post by Josh »

I have not read 4HWW, but I did purchase your money or your life along with your book to get the super-spender shipping ;)


JohnnyH
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Post by JohnnyH »

If you have access an .edu (or friend) you can get AMZN prime for free for 1 year. Just set a reminder to cancel or it will auto-renew.
@Zev: excellent analysis, I agree.


aquadump
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Post by aquadump »

I think there are more similarities than differences between ERE and 4HWW, as both describe ways to leave the rat race. ERE focuses on a sustainable solution (pile of capital) and 4HWW focuses on a passive working income. Both fit into RDPD, but under different Cashflow Quadrants.
I suspect that while Jacob focuses on Stoics, Tim might naturally go more into Kant.
I applaud Tim's efforts to bring capital together to build schools.


NYC ERE
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Post by NYC ERE »

Pete reminds me, I was surprised when Jacob started blogging about Stoicism--Ferriss recommends Seneca in several places on his blog.


aquadump
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Post by aquadump »

@Zev I stand corrected (and biased!). I stopped following 4HWW over a year ago.


jacob
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Post by jacob »

I was just about to point this out. I think stoicism is naturally appealing to NTJ (small group) or maybe even TJ (somewhat larger group). I "discovered" it in a book about moral philosophy around age 20, that is to say, I found out the stoicism was the closest to my values/opinions.
@Zev - Someone in here mentioned "A guide to the good life". I read it and it got me on a kick. I must have mentioned stoics or cynics from time to time before that though? I believe I've written about James Stockdale a couple of years ago.


NYC ERE
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Post by NYC ERE »

@jacob Perhaps you're right--I've been a reader just since late 2009.
Another major difference between the ERE book and 4HWW is that 4HWW is littered with endorsements, for businesses and websites which Ferriss surely has an arrangement with--the expanded edition even more so;
Credibility requires sacrifice.


KevinW
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Post by KevinW »

@Jacob

You mentioned in a blog post at least a year ago that your personal philosophy was closest to stoicism. That inspired me to look for stoicism resources on the internet, then I found an audio interview with Irvine promoting his book, then I read the book, then suggested it in the forum, completing the circle.


jacob
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Post by jacob »

Nice!


Maus
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Post by Maus »

Re: the distinction between 4HWW & ERE. It strikes me that it is fairly easy to be a "Stoic" when one is rolling in cash and taking mini-retirements in all the posh spots dotting the globe. TF has some good insights, but he still strikes me like one of those guys who show up on late-night TV trying to sell real estate how-tos by showing people their mansions, yachts and sports cars. You, too, CAN buy and sell real estate; but your results may vary.
Jacob, on the other hand, thrives in a much more humble environment and one that I really feel is within my own reach. He promises a meetup in Berkeley at a public park, rather than a gathering in Buenos Aires or Capetown. His stoicism therefore strikes me as far more authentic.


Chris L
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Post by Chris L »

4HHWW basically advocates starting an online business. Much easier said than done. His forum is basically dead - his blog is much more active. Sounds like he has a lot of "fans" but these fans are pretty dead beats that wont every carry out his ideas. I think that's one of the biggest things he needs to address. He has a new book the 4-hr body or something like that. Kinda makes you wonder if he isn't more of a writer than a financial freedom expert. How do you go from finance to fitness? Yeah it's possible, by why? The big picture gets more choppy with this new book.
I would have hoped he offered more guidelines to execution. As it stands his book is all about how he got shit lucky selling crappy pills on the internet. Read tipping point, a much better read than 4hhwk if you want to figure out how to be successful.


Chad
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Post by Chad »

Zev does a good job of comparing the two.
4HHWW has good information about a lot of things, but he does lose credibility based on his business relationships and his lame championship.


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Post by Andy H »

I bought both books from Amazon so I suppose it is my doing that they are showing up together. I did find some aspects of 4HWW useful and since I've been reading this blog almost from the beginning I am sure I will find ERE even more useful.


Kevin M
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Post by Kevin M »

It's like Rich Dad/Poor Dad, a catchy title with a few good ideas, but not much. I'm not surprised it would pop up on the "also bought" list since the end game is similar.
I noticed Chris Guillebeau's book was on the list today, that one surprised me a little more.


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