Late Sexuality Extreme!

Should you squeeze the toothpaste tube in the middle or from the end?
7Wannabe5
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Tue Jan 10, 2017 2:51 pm

@Bobby McGee:

There are just 3 basic steps to the female half of the conventional dance.

1) Make yourself attractive.

2) Signal availability.

3) Filter.


I don't hear you saying anything like "I would like to date, but I am too fat and psoriasis-ridden." or "Nobody ever asks me out.", so we'll put a CHECK by (1.)

So, the first potential problem area to address would be in the boundary or intersection of (1) and (2) where you may need to make more of an attempt to assume the superficial appearance, posture and behaviors readily associated with being "approachable." For many years you have been spending most of your day in a situation where you need to look attractive, or at least presentable enough to perform the duties associated with your career, while simultaneously signaling "not available' to your male co-workers. So, it is likely that you have semi-consciously adopted a posture that is either rather closed and rigid or a sort of neutered beige casual, like the office equivalent of wearing Mom jeans.

Luckily, now that you will have plenty of time at your disposal during semi-retirement, you will have ample opportunity to engage in activities that will serve to help you relax out of office posture. Spending time in nature, focusing on the aesthetic or sensual elements during any activity, interacting with other women or children or animals, focusing on your own body in a positive way (pampering) are all activities that will help you to relax in your feminine energy. Felipe did a very good job describing behaviors he engages in to help his female partners relax into their feminine energy. He has to do this because most of the females he meets are probably only advanced beginners. Generally, it is better if you learn how to do this for yourself, because then you free up your male partner to focus on invoking the masculine. IOW, you want to take care of yourself in a manner that will bring you to the first encounter with a man already in a state of post-massage relaxation. Once you achieve this state of relaxation, all you need to do is smile. Even if you are too shy to smile for more than a second before lowering your eyes, it will still work.

Okay, moving on to what should be, but often isn't, the obvious main behavior change needed to be made by many females in order to signal availability, which is YOU HAVE TO GO OUT OF YOUR HOUSE!!! The second, simple but difficult, thing you have to do is inform everybody in your social circle that you are looking for a boyfriend. Likely the first person you need to inform is yourself ;) Do it right now. Walk over to the mirror, and say it to yourself, "I, Bobby McGee (fill in real name) want a boyfriend." First rule of frugality is the same as the first rule of filtering which is don't go shopping without a list.

The second rule of filtering is the same as the second rule of dieting which is "Don't go into the donut store unless you plan on eating a donut." If you have difficulty getting to know men well enough to determine suitability before having sex because you tend towards being rather easily sexually aroused, you will have to make up two or three rules for yourself to help with that. The first rule I would suggest you adopt is if you sometimes fail at following your other rules, just let it go. Some females find jilling-off before a date to be helpful, but sometimes it has the opposite effect. Most men are actually not inclined to hard-sell for a job position they aren't looking to fill. Therefore, if you are unambiguous in communicating that you are looking for a boyfriend, then they will stick to play within those parameters. Finally, in dating realm, the donut store maxim is simply adhered to by not allowing yourself to be alone with a man in any private venue. Of course, his car is always a risk, but it's kind of unavoidable. The most important thing to remember is that if you make out with a guy in his car on Friday, he is not necessarily a better candidate to be your next boyfriend then the guy you didn't make out with on Wednesday. Keep your standards even if you lose your bra.

I hope some of this might be helpful? Have fun out there! :D

Bobby McGee
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by Bobby McGee » Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:51 pm

Yes this is very helpful. Thank you ! Made me laugh too.

1) You are right, no issues here.

" So, the first potential problem area to address would be in the boundary or intersection of (1) and (2) where you may need to make more of an attempt to assume the superficial appearance, posture and behaviors readily associated with being "approachable." For many years you have been spending most of your day in a situation where you need to look attractive, or at least presentable enough to perform the duties associated with your career, while simultaneously signaling "not available' to your male co-workers. So, it is likely that you have semi-consciously adopted a posture that is either rather closed and rigid or a sort of neutered beige casual, like the office equivalent of wearing Mom jeans "

I never thought about this. How the office environment would impact my personal life at this level. This is enlightening !
+1 on developing my feminine energy.

" If you have difficulty getting to know men well enough to determine suitability before having sex because you tend towards being rather easily sexually aroused, you will have to make up two or three rules for yourself to help with that "

Very true. I think I lack this part. Will work on it.

"Keep your standards even if you lose your bra" Yes sire !

RealPerson
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by RealPerson » Tue Jan 10, 2017 11:23 pm

@7W5

Your knowledge and understanding of human relationships in general and sexuality in particular never ceases to amaze me. Given your excellent writing style, I vote for writing some books on those topics. These are destined to be bestsellers!

Or maybe you and C40 can join forces to write from the male and female perspectives.

7Wannabe5
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:40 am

RealPerson said: Your knowledge and understanding of human relationships in general and sexuality in particular never ceases to amaze me. Given your excellent writing style, I vote for writing some books on those topics. These are destined to be bestsellers!
Thanks for the compliment but I would suffer terribly from "imposter syndrome" if I were to attempt any such thing. C40 and I are kind of on the same page because we have read some of the same books/authors and attempted the practice suggested. My advice to Bobby McGee is just a smash-up from a few different sources combined with a bit of my personal experience. Core bibliography for the above smash-up would be:

"It's a Guy Thing: Owner's Manual for Women"- David Deida
"Be Honest: You're Not That Into Him Either: Raise Your Standards and Reach for the Love You Deserve"- Ian Kerner
"Dating Rocks!: The 21 Smartest Moves Women Make for Love"- Steve Nakamoto

I was a disaster coming out of my divorce 10 years ago, but an older more-experienced-at-being-single female friend and a younger more-experienced-at-being-single male friend both got me started on reading lists that helped me boot-strap rather quickly. Since archival reading (back-tracing to original sources) is one of my hobbies, I determined that core advice towards success in this realm has been pretty consistent across time and culture, and some of it can even be traced back to Voodoo folk wisdom!!!

I would also note, or offer disclaimer, that the behavioral practices that are likely to bring success in dating/courting/sexual-attraction/romantic-attraction are only a sub-section of behavioral practices/skills needed to maintain healthy relationships over the long-run. However, I have witnessed many relationships fail due to lack of awareness/skill in this sub-set because human beings are not naturally a mate-for-life species, so there is a level on which you must always be intermittently engaging in the courtship rituals with your partner. IOW, any relationship is an open complex system which will not forever remain in the comfort zone of easy equilibrium.

7Wannabe5
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Wed Jan 11, 2017 11:50 am

I should also note that my current perspective/situation is such that the next book on my reading list in this realm is "Designer Relationships: A Guide to Happy Monogamy, Positive Polyamory, and Optimistic Open Relationships: How to Create What Works for You." by Michaels and Johnson. As the results of the AARP survey of even the less sexually active over 45 crowd clearly reveals (22% of men and 11% of women having sex outside of primary relationship in last 6 months), if some anthropologist member of an alien species were observing our species behavior from afar, and over the millennia, huge variations from the monogamous marriage norm would be noted. Increasing technology, education and affluence have made the option to choose multiple partners more available while simultaneously causing other not wholly unrelated difficulties. So, it is a bit of a chaotic mess out there these days.

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Olaz
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by Olaz » Wed Jan 11, 2017 2:58 pm

The idea of "feminine energy" (listening, care, kindness) and "masculine energy" (strength, clear, providing) seem to reproduce the binary, traditional gender norms often found in, for example, nuclear families, advertisements, TV media, news articles, k-12 schooling, etc.

Are these terms and their inherent assumptions really necessary? Even if these are socialized gender tendencies, if a man can be both kind and providing, a woman can be strong and caring, a non-binary person can be all or none of the above, or any other number of combinations, why use labels that reinforce stereotypical characteristics onto their respective genders?

7Wannabe5
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:36 pm

Olaz said: Are these terms and their inherent assumptions really necessary? Even if these are socialized gender tendencies, if a man can be both kind and providing, a woman can be strong and caring, a non-binary person can be all or none of the above, or any other number of combinations, why use labels that reinforce stereotypical characteristics onto their respective genders?
No and yes, and yes and no.

A friend of mine who is a very conventionally attractive woman developed a crush on a famous quite-overtly-uber-masculine journalist/writer who was going to do a signing at the bookstore where we both worked. It was part of her job to pick him up at the airport. The next day, I asked "So, how did it go?" and she grinned and said "I f*cked him blind." Obviously, what she meant to convey was that she had whipped herself tight as a top with self-induced through idol-worshiping behavior mix of testosterone/dopamine????, so she was the driving-energy partner within the context of that encounter. In life, as in sex, the most attractive individuals are those who are strong in both energies and can freely choose to exhibit them as desired.

OTOH, I personally know many people who have experimented with taking testosterone, and there can be no denying the fact that it has an effect on drive and personality. Beyond simply popping a pill or applying a cream, there are many behaviors that can boost or reduce testosterone levels and drive. Exercise, overt success, status gain, observing new hen in the barnyard, all tend towards raising testosterone levels. Human beings who were born with testicles usually behave as though they have more testosterone in their blood stream than people who were not born with testicles, because usually they do have more testosterone in their blood stream. I don't think it is beneficial to deny this reality. I do not think it is beneficial to overstate or repressively reinforce the ramifications of this reality.

Ironically, although men on average have higher and stronger sex drives than women on average, they are actually more fragile in their sexual functioning. To put it in simple, obvious terms, a male can not engage in the act of sexual intercourse unless he is physiologically sexually aroused, and a female can. Also, males have a much longer on average refractory period than females. Therefore, drive and arousal and behavior tend towards being differently muddled and mixed in those who have outies vs. innies. Sexuality is generally experienced as more binary on/off by males and more wave pattern by females. I also have a good deal of experience interacting with men who have lost the ability to easily achieve an erection when aroused, so I have a feel for how this is the opposite of the manner in which a female can choose to function even if she is not aroused. There is a limit to the ability (even with aid of active imagination and props) to assign homologous organs similar purpose. The brain wiring isn't even the same. For instance, most men have a nervous system superhighway connecting their visual cortex to their penis, and eyes-to-clitoris superhighway is not the case for most women. Another example would be that I have noted that men who have nipples that are erogenous are more likely to be ambient in their sexual functioning than men who have "dead" nipples. Some wiring can be changed with training or practice, but only so far up or down the dial.

So, when directed strength/energy is labeled as "masculine" and responsive strength/energy is labeled as "feminine", there is a level of which this is reflective of physiology and indicative of preferences. OTOH, I absolutely believe that each individual human has a unique and evolving fingerprint in terms of sexual identity, so ...?

Have you seen the movie "Wetlands?" Great depiction of a character who exhibits a lot of crazy-strong juvenile mixed feminine and masculine sexual behavior and appearance.

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Dragline
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by Dragline » Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:47 pm

7Wannabe5 wrote: A friend of mine who is a very conventionally attractive woman developed a crush on a famous quite-overtly-uber-masculine journalist/writer who was going to do a signing at the bookstore where we both worked. It was part of her job to pick him up at the airport. The next day, I asked "So, how did it go?" and she grinned and said "I f*cked him blind." Obviously, what she meant to convey was that she had whipped herself tight as a top with self-induced through idol-worshiping behavior mix of testosterone/dopamine????, so she was the driving-energy partner within the context of that encounter. In life, as in sex, the most attractive individuals are those who are strong in both energies and can freely choose to exhibit them as desired.
It's that grand old story of "She offered her honor, he honored her offer, and all night long it was on her and off her." A classic. :lol:

Felipe
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by Felipe » Thu Jan 12, 2017 12:42 pm

@ Olaz, what's your perspective on what humans find attractive?

I'm also curious, were you born as someone who was naturally attractive or was this a field that required focused effort for you to cultivate?

I find that all those traits you mentioned are things that either gender finds attractive in general, who doesn't want a caring partner who listens?

I see masculine and feminine as energies that create polarity of a focused vs receptive energy.

There is masculine in every feminine and vice versa. I enjoy the dancing between these 2 and occasional switching of energy here, it is not black and white but more of a tendency that fuels more passionate fun.

Moreover, there are many things that humans simply find attractive that are irrelevant to the dichotomy.

7Wannabe5
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Thu Jan 19, 2017 5:15 am

Image

Image


Coincidence? I think not. My hypothesis is that it has something to do with the balance between capital and venture OR power and initiative OR mature masculine energy and juvenile masculine energy OR height and acceleration.

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Dragline
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by Dragline » Thu Jan 19, 2017 9:39 am

This looks a lot like some obesity maps I saw in an article yesterday:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/us-obesit ... 48031.html

Look at the ones by age. Although they are not exactly comparable on the age ranges with what's above, you can see that obesity picks after age 45, but then tails off sharply for older people.

Why is this true? One could theorize that people get thinner and more sexually capable when older, but my guess is that the obese people just die off before the others, leaving a more healthy and sexually capable older population. Dead people don't make it into the data.

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Ego
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by Ego » Thu Jan 19, 2017 10:14 am

Dragline wrote: Why is this true? One could theorize that people get thinner and more sexually capable when older, but my guess is that the obese people just die off before the others, leaving a more healthy and sexually capable older population. Dead people don't make it into the data.
Mortality may be part of it, but there is another more likely cause. Antibiotic use in childhood is very strongly linked with obesity in adulthood.

http://time.com/4082242/antibiotics-obesity/

“The more antibiotics you get, the stronger the effect,” says Schwartz. “And this effect seems to get larger as you get older.”

It is really a no brainer. Farmers have been using sub-therapeutic doses of antibiotics in cattle feed for decades because they know it causes massive growth surges and improves the feed conversion ratio.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antibioti ... _livestock
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feed_conversion_ratio

Those over 65 did not get antibiotics as kids at the rates of later generations.

7Wannabe5
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Thu Jan 19, 2017 2:23 pm

Dragline said: Why is this true? One could theorize that people get thinner and more sexually capable when older, but my guess is that the obese people just die off before the others, leaving a more healthy and sexually capable older population. Dead people don't make it into the data.
Likely the most obvious explanation due to complex systems interactions shown in this diagram:

Image


Of course, central body weight gain, androgen (as well as other hormone) decline, increased risk of heart disease, osteoporosis, and depression, and variety of sexual symptoms are also seen in post-menopausal females. Recent research reveals that menopause is more of a symptom of a point along an arc of aging and hormonal level decline than a causative factor. Free testosterone levels in average, aging members of both genders will have declined to almost half of peak level by the time they are in their 50s. So, some sort of similar, but perhaps even a bit more complex, diagram would also apply to females.

One of the purposes of this thread is to examine to what extent and by what combination of methods one could still retire "early" at mid-life through engaging in frugal practices that will serve to reverse or reduce the flow along the above system by applying particular focus on the box labeled "Low Androgen Levels." In simplest terms, we will assume level of sexual functioning to be clearer indication of "years until death or disability" than "years since birth" and develop a formula that will be something along the lines of (Future F*cks/ F*ck You Assets) = Total Extreme Utility of Early Retirement.

Ego said: It is really a no brainer. Farmers have been using sub-therapeutic doses of antibiotics in cattle feed for decades because they know it causes massive growth surges and improves the feed conversion ratio.
True, and I just learned this morning (by following Jacob's suggestion to google hydroxyl methane) that there is a drug that farmers feed to livestock to reduce their methane emissions that also causes them to be able to digest more of the energy available from their feed. IOW, it causes the cows to temporarily sequester more carbon. So, I guess when affluent middle-aged human males attempt to digest green smoothies in order to improve their androgen levels, they are also making a slight contribution to global warming. What a complex world we live in.

classical_Liberal
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by classical_Liberal » Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:50 pm

I have found this conversation fascinating. Of particular impact was felipe's concise rehash of OP’s thoughts:
Felipe wrote:@Stahlmann
My perception was that creating a life with more sexual intimacy dampens the need for status as it more deeply fulfills what status attempts to satisfy, nobody is being called a loser or to dump their status.
I find this to be anecdotally true for myself. Having a beautiful lady (or better ladies) with whom I am having great sex automatically permeates into all other aspects of my life. While my perceived status in society may increase when my success becomes known in a social group, it is the internal feeling of sexual success that provides the most confidence and benefit. Success also seems to breed more success.
I wonder if the presented statistical trends are a reflection of advisement and the consumer based society in which we live (US centric). As people age and spend more effort accumulating monetary wealth (as society says one should) they see a decrease sexual success. Human beings are then saturated with advertisements clearly demonstrating sexual success is based on the car one drives, the suit one wears, or the size of one’s breasts. To regain past sexual success the human “logically” spends more time accumulating wealth to purchase these sexuality enhancing items, which only serves to further reduce time and energy available to pursue sexual relationships, a feedback loop ensues. IOW, A peacock's feathers are only useful if there are hens available to admire them and the peacock has the time/energy/ability to procreate.

Obviously biological drive has an influence in the young being most sexually successful, but I would argue a good portion of that success also revolves around the lifestyle that is lead at those earlier points in life. In late teens and early 20’s a great deal of time and energy is spent socializing, living near or with, and pursuing those of the opposite (or same) sex. Much less time and energy is spent in accumulation of wealth or things, and that which is spent at work or studying is often with other single peers (accidental web of goals?). Attempting to recreate this situation in adult life has proven anchedotaly in my life that sexual success increases as well. It is practice that creates improvement, so great sex is more likely to be achieved the more often a human being has the opportunity to participate in the activity.

Regarding antibiotics, diets and the like, unfortunately (or fortunately) due to ethics correlational evidence is the best we can do when researching the health epidemic in the US. I have no doubt that antibiotic use in livestock, the introduction of high fructose corn syrup as a staple, and the general SAD diet combined with lack of exercise has a huge impact in reducing biological sex drive. All of these things also likely individually contribute to the heart disease and obesity epidemic, whether one is a higher contributor than others will be difficult to prove. This is why it is so important for individuals to experiment with diet and exercise thereby reaching a satisfactory S curve point for their health.

7Wannabe5
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:02 am

classical_Liberal said: Obviously biological drive has an influence in the young being most sexually successful, but I would argue a good portion of that success also revolves around the lifestyle that is lead at those earlier points in life. In late teens and early 20’s a great deal of time and energy is spent socializing, living near or with, and pursuing those of the opposite (or same) sex. Much less time and energy is spent in accumulation of wealth or things, and that which is spent at work or studying is often with other single peers (accidental web of goals?). Attempting to recreate this situation in adult life has proven anchedotaly in my life that sexual success increases as well. It is practice that creates improvement, so great sex is more likely to be achieved the more often a human being has the opportunity to participate in the activity.
This has also been my experience. However, I would say that it has as much to do with fulfillment of obligations as status seeking. Sexual activity is regarded as "dessert" rather than simple sustenance, and desire is often over-ruled by Puritan work ethic. More evidence below that this is a seriously counter-productive cycle/practice. Frequent sexual activity, because positive stress inducing, appears to have much the same influence on creation of new growth in the brain as running for exercise.
Aversive stressful experiences are typically associated with increased anxiety and a predisposition to develop mood disorders. Negative stress also suppresses adult neurogenesis and restricts dendritic architecture in the hippocampus, a brain region associated with anxiety regulation. The effects of aversive stress on hippocampal structure and function have been linked to stress-induced elevations in glucocorticoids. Normalizing corticosterone levels prevents some of the deleterious consequences of stress, including increased anxiety and suppressed structural plasticity in the hippocampus. Here we examined whether a rewarding stressor, namely sexual experience, also adversely affects hippocampal structure and function in adult rats. Adult male rats were exposed to a sexually-receptive female once (acute) or once daily for 14 consecutive days (chronic) and levels of circulating glucocorticoids were measured. Separate cohorts of sexually experienced rats were injected with the thymidine analog bromodeoxyuridine in order to measure cell proliferation and neurogenesis in the hippocampus. In addition, brains were processed using Golgi impregnation to assess the effects of sexual experience on dendritic spines and dendritic complexity in the hippocampus. Finally, to evaluate whether sexual experience alters hippocampal function, rats were tested on two tests of anxiety-like behavior: novelty suppressed feeding and the elevated plus maze. We found that acute sexual experience increased circulating corticosterone levels and the number of new neurons in the hippocampus. Chronic sexual experience no longer produced an increase in corticosterone levels but continued to promote adult neurogenesis and stimulate the growth of dendritic spines and dendritic architecture. Chronic sexual experience also reduced anxiety-like behavior. These findings suggest that a rewarding experience not only buffers against the deleterious actions of early elevated glucocorticoids but actually promotes neuronal growth and reduces anxiety.
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/articl ... ne.0011597

IOW, not having sex on a regular basis will make you brain dead sooner rather than later.

Stahlmann
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by Stahlmann » Sun Feb 05, 2017 3:33 pm

We met in different topic :D
Back then discussion was pretty heated.
I am now cooled down.

So my question now:

How would you address problems of young, frustrated chump?

Constraints:
1. I am tired of rejections.
2. Not attractive on looks level (at the moment some injuries which prevent me to be in shape and just bring me down mentally :/).
3. Not attractive on financial level (ERE fan).


I just want to feel affection of second person and have sex regularly.

General Snoopy
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by General Snoopy » Mon Feb 06, 2017 11:24 am

@Stahlmann: The first rule is to not take advice from a woman. A woman does not understand the man's experience.

You need to understand that the world is a ruthless place. A woman, instinctively if not consciously, wants a man that can survive and even prosper in such an environment.

7Wannabe5
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Re: Late Sexuality Extreme!

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Mon Feb 06, 2017 1:44 pm

General Snoopy said: The first rule is to not take advice from a woman. A woman does not understand the man's experience.

You need to understand that the world is a ruthless place. A woman, instinctively if not consciously, wants a man that can survive and even prosper in such an environment.
True-ish, but it's okay for Stahlmann to take advice from me because I am aged and fairly self-aware. Anyways, I was going to recommend that he read "The Way of the Superior Man" by Dieda, which includes topic headings such as "Never Change Your Mind Just to Please a Woman" and "She Wants the 'Killer' in You." , so we are essentially in agreement.

@Stahlmann:

What you will learn if you read this book with an open mind is that looks and money are not as attractive as being strong in your purpose. Women hate wishy-washy almost as much as they hate arrogance.

One of the best methods for planning a fun and inexpensive date is to just organize an adventure or mission you would have undertaken on your own, because it is in alignment with your interests or purpose, and then get a female to ride sidekick with you. As in:

"I'm planning on doing the 3 hour dune hike this weekend. You up for it?"

"There's some giant green bug with weird scales in my garden. I need you to get over here and help me find it again and identify it."

" I finished the next chapter of my memoir of being on the road with the band. Will you proof-read it for me? I'll make you dinner too."

"I'm going scrappin' Get your overalls on and I'll pick you up in an hour."

First. Take the lead. Form the frame. Then concern yourself with seeing to the comfort, pleasure of your date. There are many men who are superficially very successful, attractive, well-endowed with assets of any kind, who are still as at drift at core as an unemployed kid living in his Grandma's basement. Unfortunately, its one of those true things that are difficult to grasp because being engaged in your purpose will make you more attractive to females, but attempting to find a purpose in order to attract females will prove counter-productive, unless you also think of the behavior as a gift-of-sexuality that you can offer. The simple analogy would be something like:

1) Develop muscles in order to reach personal rowing goal.
2) Developed muscles as side-effect attract females.
3) Being aware of effect of muscles on female allows you to consciously engage them for purposes of arousal.

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