Transportation Survey

Live local, get around without breaking the bank
M
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 7:34 pm

Post by M »

So how have you solved the transportation problem? For the purposes of ERE an ideal solution is to walk and/or ride a bicycle, but realistically it seems that many people on this forum own some sort of vehicles that they drive.
So I'm curious...have you managed to go car free? If so, do you walk, ride a bicycle, or take public transportation? If you ride a bicycle, what kind is it? How much did it cost to purchase? Why did you choose this kind of bicycle?
If you haven't been able to go car free, what kind of vehicle do you drive and why? How much does it cost to operate and maintain, and how much did it cost to purchase? How long do you expect it to last? Are there any members on here who have actually followed through with the lifer strategy and kept a vehicle for 40 years or more?
Hopefully this will give everyone an idea of how other ERE members have tackled the transportation problem. Perhaps we can take this information and make an ERE car buying guide in the wiki or something.
I'll start: I own two 2000 chevy metros that I purchased 8 years ago. I paid $2300 for one and $1500 for the other. Together I have spent about $3,000 in maintenance and repairs over the years, including oil, tires, new starter, new CV axles, belts, brakes, batteries, etc. I have put 100,000 miles on one and 30,000 miles on the other. They get around 30 in the city and 39-40 on the highway(they would get better fuel economy, but they are both 3 speed automatics). One of the metros has a rust problem, among other things, and I only expect it to last another year or two at the most. The other metro, I think should last another 8 years with ease.
What kind of transportation do you use?


dot_com_vet
Posts: 603
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2011 2:07 am

Post by dot_com_vet »

I live in the city and work in the suburbs, so bus is not an option since I'm going the "wrong" direction. I could get a monthly pass for $5, which would be a great option.
I drive a 2009 Honda that I purchased new for $12k. (W/ cash for clunkers trade in.)
I do my own maintenance, averaging $25/year. Gas is $900/year + $225/year insurance + $170/year for tags.


chenda
Posts: 3289
Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:17 pm
Location: Nether Wallop

Post by chenda »

I walk to most essential things, other than that I have a company car at the moment so I just pay for petrol. Its essential for work but not much else. When I retire I don't think I'll keep a car, they just eat money and most of the costs are fixed.
I do like the idea though of living in a remote area for a while, so a car would probably be essential then.


George the original one
Posts: 5404
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:28 am
Location: Wettest corner of Orygun

Post by George the original one »

Oh, you're hitting my ERE fail :-)
2008 Hyundai Sonata purchased new, 20k mi/yr combination of commuting and travel. Halfway through expected lifespan of 10 years. Size was selected to ensure room for mom's wheelchair.
Workday commute is 35 miles roundtrip from rural Oregon City location to downtown Portland. Weekly-ish commute to future coastal rain forest retirement home is 180 mies roundtrip.
Operational costs:

$200/mo fuel

$50/mo insurance (will drop collision when value <$6k)

$165/mo parking

Estimate $35/mo maintenance
****
Now using that car is not the real ERE fail... no, the fail is the fact that I've got a dozen more cars in various states of existence <ahem>, some which are racing vehicles that will never see the street. On the positive side, they are 25-45 years old, so well recycled.


User avatar
Ego
Posts: 6359
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 12:42 am

Post by Ego »

Honda Fit and Cars2Go membership as a backup if we both need the car at the same time.


RealPerson
Posts: 875
Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:33 pm

Post by RealPerson »

I use a bicycle for a lot of my own transportation needs. It is a Surly CrossCheck. It was a previous year model on sale for $900 brand new. I equipped it with fenders, lights and panniers. I also replaced the brakes because the brakes on the bike were scary. The frame on these bikes is terrific, but they equip them with basic accessories to keep the cost down. I can live with entry level shifters but not entry level brakes. Total upgrades were a couple of $100. I know that I have saved more in cost of driving than the total cost of the bicycle. Plus... you stay in shape.
I am now looking at a bike trailer to haul more stuff than the panniers can hold.


anomie
Posts: 442
Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:13 pm
Location: midwest, usa

Post by anomie »

- Walk most everywhere I go; our midwestern town is centered on a large hill which prohibits scooting around town on a bicycle.

- Telecommute to work from home

- 1/2 ownership in a 2003 Honda CRV my DW drives 3 days/ week.


J_
Posts: 883
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2011 4:12 pm
Location: Netherlands/Austria

Post by J_ »

In winter (3 months): everything on foot.

The rest: on bicycle and foot. price second hand bicycle (Koga Miata automatic gears 4) seven years ago $ 440, maintenance by me.
(For ongoing real estate project and one holiday abroad: secondhand bought car 9 years old, fuel 2012: $ 855

insurance, maintenance and road-tax for 2012: $ 763. Car will go after finishing real estate project).
Yearly trip to winter-home: airplane and train vise versa: $ 168


Felix
Posts: 1272
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2010 6:30 pm

Post by Felix »

I walk and occasionally take public transportation when visiting people. I'm part of a local carsharing but have never used it.


DividendGuy
Posts: 441
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 9:58 pm

Post by DividendGuy »

This is one of the more difficult aspects of ERE for me.
I'm car-free and have been so for the last two years. I live in a city (Sarasota, FL) that is not exactly friendly to those without a car.
I use the bus for most of my transportation needs. It costs about $60/mo.
I also have a 1997 49cc Yamaha Zuma scooter I purchased for $700. It requires very little monthly outlay. About $5/mo in gas. No insurance necessary and repairs are none so far. It doesn't require oil changes. Gets about 70 mpg.
However, it's not easy...especially in this city. I've thought recently about getting a car again, but I do love the cheap lifestyle I have now. Cars can really suck a wallet dry.


Christopherjart
Posts: 191
Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:03 am
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Post by Christopherjart »

I haven't had a car for 12 years. I walk when I can and I'll also take bus, subway, etc. to get around. Distances to classes are too far to bike even if I had a place for a bike. A normal trip here in Mexico city is about 1 hour. Less than 45 minutes is considered close and more than an hour and a half is far. :-/ Imagine how long it would take you to bike somewhere you'd get to by subway in 40 minutes! I suppose it would be doable once retired, but until then there just isn't enough free time.


DutchGirl
Posts: 1646
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: The Netherlands

Post by DutchGirl »

Well, I live in the Netherlands, in a very crowded area with lots of public transport. So I walk, bike (yup, the Netherlands) and take the public transport. My boyfriend has a car, though, so sometimes I cheat and we go visit my family (2.5 hours away by car, 3.5 hours away by public transport) or the shop by car. The car is a 2nd hand tiny toyota from the previous century.


CS
Posts: 709
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2012 10:24 pm

Post by CS »

We have a 1999 Honda that costs little to gas and maintain, which we will keep. We are selling a Chevy that cost too much in both repairs and gas (12 mpg in the city!!). So it will be a one car, two bike family. Walking is the preferred mode of transportation, at least for me.


KevinW
Posts: 959
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2010 4:45 am

Post by KevinW »

We live next to a light rail station which greatly expands our public transit options in exchange for some concessions in other areas. DW commutes by train which is about $110/month after her employer's subsidy. Most days I take the train and then bike 3 miles; my pass is about $20/month subsidized. On good days I bike the entire 10 miles with no train. On bad days (e.g. sick) I take the train then bus with no biking. Due to our central location, we can walk to most amenities. We also make heavy use of drop shipping services to avoid traveling for errands.
BUT, I also must confess an ERE sin: I have 1/2 share of a Subaru Outback. My wife was willing to compromise with a one-car household but wasn't willing to go car-free. The use cases that I couldn't rebut were visiting relatives 25 miles away in a transit dead zone, and taking dogs to the vet 2 miles away. We chose this model after a protracted research process. The requirements were a hatch area for dogs, excellent reliability and durability, DIY-friendly, and an intangible "feels safe" criterion.
One problem with having the car is that its indispensability is a self-fulfilling prophecy. For example in principle I should buy a cargo bike or trailer and scout the ideal route to groceries 4 miles away. But the car is there so we just use that every time. Our neighborhood is getting more developed, ZipCars just went in, and frankly those relatives probably won't be around much longer, so I hope in a few years the arguments for keeping a car will dissolve.
My bike is a 1980s Cannondale road bike marketed as "sport-touring," so its geometry is halfway between a touring and race bike and it has brazeons for everything. IIRC the bike, resto-mod parts, and a Topeak rack and bag system came to about $400. I discussed this here a couple years ago: viewtopic.php?t=322
If I were starting from scratch I would probably build a bike out of a Surly Long Haul Trucker touring frame, the simplest gearing setup that is sufficient for local terrain, and a Bikes At Work trailer for occasional big hauls. Or, lately I've been toying with the idea of a cheap two-speed for everyday use, like the Torker KB2, plus a dedicated cargo bike like the Surly Big Dummy.
I don't have figures on car expenses, but I'd estimate gas is $50/month, insurance and license is $100/month (California...), and regular maintenance is $200/year (DIY). It will eventually need tires and brakes which will cost more of course.


wastelandwaltz
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:08 pm
Contact:

Post by wastelandwaltz »

My city is quite small and pedestrian-friendly with a mild climate, so most of my transportation is on foot. I use a bus or a tram about once a week if I need to get any further, maybe to visit family, that sort of thing.
If I have to get somewhere urgently, at an awkward time of night, or carrying something heavy/bulky I'll get a taxi. This is pretty rare though, just a couple of times a year. This would usually be something like €20. I don't mind paying this to a professional car-owner rather than having my own car.
More motivation to stay away from cars comes from the fact that there's very little parking where I live, and 60% of the price of petrol here is government taxes. http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/ta ... 21314.html
Also I drive horribly...


chicago81
Posts: 307
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2012 3:24 pm
Location: Chicago, IL

Post by chicago81 »

I drive an old gas guzzler of a car that I bought for $5000 cash, 7 years ago.

Mostly just use it to drive to/from work and the grocery store. I live close to work, and I think I only put 3000 miles on the car last year. It does require the expensive fuel, because the car has a super charger. In Chicago, I probably paid on average around $4.25/gal and get only 13mpg in the city. Probably paid about $600 for liability insurance last year too. Add another $200 for plate and city stickers, and about $200 a year for maintenance (I've been fortunate -- have had minimal repairs.)
Now I'm curious, what my annual cost is... I'll calculate it right here:
Purchase Price = $5000 / 7yrs = $715

Gas = (3000mi / 13mpg) * $4.25 = $981

Insurance = $600

Maintenance = $200

Stickers = $200

------

Total annual cost of ownership and driving is approx $2700
I could get unlimited bus/train passes in Chicago, which currently run $100/mo. So my choosing to drive my car in Chicago, I am spending $1500 more. Riding a bike is an option, but I'm not "extreme" enough to test myself against the deadly combination of Chicago Traffic and Chicago Winter Weather.
By driving to work, instead of taking public transportation, I probably save at least one hour per work-day. Excluding any other travel, and assuming about 250 work days per year, the car saves me 250 hours over the course of the year, simply with counting for commuting to work (versus taking the bus.)
This works out to $1500 / 250 = $6 per hour. I am willing to buy extra hours of my life for $6/hr.

Of course there are other intangible benefits and drawbacks to both transportation options. (Ex: being able to relax on a train or bus and read while riding to work instead of fighting traffic, road rage, etc. But then there are times where the busses and trains are packed with people, are very late, contain people who have vomited or urinated everywhere, etc.)
I think I've made the right choice :)


FarmOne
Posts: 69
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 3:16 pm

Post by FarmOne »

We live in rural Oregon where the nearest small town is 14 miles. There is no public transportation options. We used to have a 93 Honda Civic ($3300). It always got over 40 mpg (using hyper-miling techniques), but after going over 150K miles it began needing frequent expensive repairs (about $300 every three months). After some close calls, and seeing collisions suffered by family members on the roads we frequent, we began weighing the car's low cost of operation against it's safety aspects.
There are a lot of undocumented worker's in our area operating large farm trucks. They are especially careless during harvest when they are rushed to get the produce to market. 90% of our driving over distances is at highway speeds with fair to poor road conditions and animals frequently on the road. My MIL totalled her car by running into the rear of a stopped car on the highway at 60+mph. My father totalled his pickup hitting a cow on the highway at 60+ mph. Thankfully neither of them were injured other than bumps and bruises.
Now that I'm ERE (to a larger extent), I plan trips to town about every two weeks. I use lists generated over those two weeks to make the trip to town the most beneficial. I network with family and hitch a ride when ever practical.
We traded up the Honda Civic ($2000) to a 97 Buick Riviera ($2200). It only exceeds 30mpg using the same driving technique, but has been much more reliable in terms of repair than the Honda, and (more importantly) it is a much safer car.
For heavier loads, and use around the farm, we employ a 95 Chevy K1500 ($4500 seven years ago). It has been a very dependable and low cost work vehicle to operate. For short trips to neighbors and around the farm, I use a 91 Kawasaki 220 ($900 eight years ago) four wheeler (when I don't have the time to walk). It averages about 40 mpg and has required very minimal maintenance.
I have always done all of my own mechanic work. I had four years of auto mechanics in high school and worked in an automotive machine shop part/full time my last two years in high school. I also have extensive training and experience from ~25 years of electro-mechanical maintenance employment. I employ many Japanese and world-class style maintenance philosophies. Minimizing labor costs on maintaining your own equipment can really add up over the years...


BPA
Posts: 150
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 5:02 pm

Post by BPA »

I walk or cycle. I bought my bike from a seller on kijiji (like Craigslist) for $125. It's a Schwinn commuter bike and I love it. I've never owned a car.
To get to other cities (Toronto is the nearest "big city") I use public transportation.


rube
Posts: 883
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:54 pm
Location: Europe (NL)

Post by rube »

We have one car, maybe not fully ERE, but with a family of 4 it's more convienent.

Car is 9 years old, fairly good mpg (max 6L/100km) and fixed costs are limited. Dirving around 17K km/year.
I use public transport to commute (only twice a week)

We all got bikes of course (the Netherlands).


JohnnyH
Posts: 2005
Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:00 pm
Location: Rockies

Post by JohnnyH »

The ultimate ERE transportation:

http://www.break.com/usercontent/2007/1 ... xle-383947
bike: steel frame Schwinn ranger, $27 + free local pickup on ebay no reserve auction... Have ridiculous miles on this bike, but still rides well.

car: 1996 Geo Prizm (Toyota Corolla), about $1800 after repairs. 33-39mpg, manual trans. Has over 100k, but these are known for doing 250-300k with ease.

truck: 1970s Chevy truck, less than $1,000. 3/4 ton, 14-18mpg. Runs great, dependable work horse. Parts are ubiquitous and inexpensive. Car was designed to be maintained and fixed by operator.

Welt boots: most common form of transport.
Bike cost is very minimal, since its still on most original parts.

Vehicles are on permanent plates, so only monthly cost is about $20 insurance... I've spent $539 on parts since 2008, done all work myself. I've spent about $150-400 a year in gas, almost all for various trips.

Generally I don't drive enough to warrant an oil change every year, but I have been taking more trips as I near ER.
I don't need or rely on a car, but it greatly increases my options and freedom of movement. Very worth the $20 month carrying costs... If nothing else they are investments and inflation hedges, since I drive very little and generally improve their condition...


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