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Harmonica Charlie's ERE Journal

(36 posts)
  1. Harmonica Charlie

    Novice
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 14

    I am new to ERE, still in the middle of the book and have been reading the forums these past two weeks for a few minutes a day.

    I am a father of two year old triplets (two boys and a girl). They have many therapeutic needs right now as they were born under two pounds and have significant development issues to this point.

    My wife is a stay at home mother and NOT at all on board with ERE yet, though I plan to continue talking her through this as I implement the steps for my own finances. I honestly feel like a human ATM at times and my children have every comfort imaginable.

    I am 38, and actually had my primary home paid off at age 36. And I had six other rental units that, while still not paid off, were bringing in rents of approximately $2500 a month. There are offsetting expenses with that, which I will detail.

    When we had the triplets, we felt our 750 square foot home was too small, and a rash of break-ins/ vandals on the street had us thinking that the neighborhood was going down hill plus you need to wear Kevlar if you want to attend public school there, so last October, we upgraded to a much bigger home in a suburb of Buffalo, NY (lots of snow so forget bicycles six months of the year) and we have a $129,500 mortgage leftover as of this writing. I pay the mortgage bi-weekly, $575 which includes Taxes and Homeowners Insurance.

    To be clear, my wife will NOT let us move back to the old house, nor any other house for that matter. She is convinced this is the house she wants to live in till the kids move out in a couple of decades. It was not a good conversation when I broached ERE topic with her.

    We are currently renting the home we vacated and splitting the rental income with her brother. That brings total monthly rental income of all the properties to $2700.

    I am sure if I can show a significant amount of increased savings, decreased debt to zero, and show a passive income stream that takes care of everything and more, she’ll be on board. I just think that I have more of an uphill battle than some of the other stories I read here.

    To each their own…we must walk our own path from where we stand now, not from where someone else is standing.

    I do NOT want to continue to be a landlord…at least not for all of the properties. On this, my wife and I agree. Too much worry in addition to the kids and everything else going on. In my ERE scenario, I will keep one of the four rental homes, and I have the specific one in mind which currently generates just under a thousand a month in rents. Yearly taxes on that property are around $1400 ($117 a month), Hazard Insurance is $750/year ($62.50 a month) and quarterly bills for Water and Garbage average out to about $65 a month.

    I used to be able to ride my bike to work when I was in the other home, which was only 5 miles away from work. I now live 22 miles from work, and there are no buses that will take me to work, nor no one I know of that I could car pool with.

    On the plus side, I work from home two days per week and there is every indication that this may increase to three or more days per week by 2013 as the bank I work for goes into serious restructure and consolidation and is encouraging more work from home, where it makes sense. I am a compliance office who makes just under 100k a year. If I add rental income in, then I make about 132k. I broached selling my long ago paid off car, and she did not like that idea at all, even in an ERE scenario. She’s convinced that it would be logistically nightmarish when the triplets get to school age and get involved with separate activities.

    My wife just started a bootstrap small business this month, selling women’s purses or organizational stuff like giant bags. She already has four parties booked this month and expects to bring in a three hundred a month conservatively.

    I blog and write books as my passion. All my previous books are off the market now, but I will have one on Meditation coming out in October, self-published on my blog, likely as an ebook only to start. Given how new this present blog is (Aug 31) I’d be lucky to make a hundred dollars a month for the next several months at that. The goal is that this income helps move the snowball in the right direction for ERE and that it may end up I continue to do this to supplement ERE if I still enjoy it several years from now.

    This entry is getting very long so I will break it here...

    Posted 1 year ago #
  2. Harmonica Charlie

    Novice
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 14

    My major debts are as follows:

    Credit Card (groan…just shoot me now) = around $13,000 (will have exact figures when I post in October for September).

    Auto Minivan (we do have triplets after all) = $16,500 (can’t get exact number because BofA won’t let me enroll the loan on their online banking

    Rental House #1 Mortgage = $20,045 (duplex that gets $665 in monthly rents)
    Rental House #2 Mortgage (This is the one I want to keep) - $49,094 (duplex that gets $975 in monthly rents)
    Rental House #3 Mortgage = $54,418 (duplex that gets $810 in monthly rents)
    Primary Residence Mortgage = $129,500

    In the Spring of 2012 I’d like to put Rental Houses 1 and 3 on the market to simplify my responsibilities a fair bit. Property #1 I think I can get like $30-35,000 for. House is in good shape but it is a depressed area. House #3, I don’t think I can get more than $45,000 for but I honestly haven’t researched the Comps in the area. I bought House 1 for $43,000 in 2003 and House 3 in 2003 with no money down for $62,100…poor decisions but now I must live with them.

    My wife is on board with tracking our spending this month, at least, and for the foreseeable future. I think she is okay with cutting back on some things but not if it drastically effects her day to day living. For example, for 10 years I’ve been trying to get us to cancel cable. She won’t have it, saying she’s home alone with the kids all day and needs the background noise.

    I’ve not altered our spending behavior yet as I don’t have a picture of what we are doing. That’s why we are tracking this month. There were some oddball incomes and outgo’s already. We had to take a distribution on a beneficiary IRA and we put that money immediately on a credit card. We paid for a preschool program for the kids a couple of days a week (I know, I’m sure there will be a fair number of detractors here on that decision but again, the wife wanted that). She’s of the mind that she wants our children to have an affluent upbringing that she didn’t have where as I had an affluent upbringing and want to simplify and ERE. It leads to a lot of arguments as I often feel like a human ATM.

    Obviously we’ll have to come to a compromise or this will be an impossible situation.

    What I am bracing everyone for is that when I post my September numbers you’ll see a large amount of income and a large amount of outgo…and I am expecting to get my head handed to me on the boards here for that. Perhaps that is what I need. And think of the fun you guys will have deconstructing my mistakes!

    I’ve set my aim in September already to put all leftover income at the one credit card so it will look like I’ve spent 100% of my income for September. I suspect that the next six months or so will be the same type of thing…throw everything at the credit cards.

    Our big worry about ERE is health insurance for the kids and it is my wife’s primary argument against Early retirement. She is very fearful for the future in general. I work for a company that has publicly vowed to cut 30K jobs in the next 2 years and it seems to be indiscriminate who gets the ax so far. For me, that is all the more reason to get my arse in gear NOW and move toward ERE.

    They (my kids) are considered disabled due to their low birth weight and they receive numerous in home therapies (Speech, Physical, Occupational, Special Ed). Right now this is all covered 100% with work Health Insurance (golden handcuffs). I don’t even know if I can get insured privately when I’ll need it and New York State is highway robbery with insurance and taxes.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  3. Harmonica Charlie

    Novice
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 14

    Ok, I babbled a lot in the first two posts, sorry. It was quite the brain dump but I am still missing some key pieces of information to share, which I hope to flesh out.

    I am still looking at ways at increasing income and may start a part time SEO Writer side-business as I have a well-developed gift for writing quickly (and occasionally making sense).

    And once I have my numbers in for all of October, I will start cutting. I can already see two weeks in that I have a nasty habit of buying books and harmonica gear. So if I put the kabash on those, I will already save a couple of hundred a month off my outgoing money.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  4. jacob

    Expert
    Joined: Jul '10
    Posts: 3,293

    Why are your previous books off the market? Do you have the rights to those?

    Posted 1 year ago #
  5. LiquidSapphire

    Master
    Joined: Jul '11
    Posts: 433

    Hi, welcome.
    Sounds like you have an uphill battle but you can certainly make it happen with the right attitude and adjustments. It seems to me your biggest struggle will be getting your wife on board.

    I can't remember what financial blog I read it on (GRS?) but the author had persuaded his wife to give up cable by doing a trial for 6 months and promising that ANY TV show she wanted that wasn't on Cable she could go buy via iTunes. Turns out they didn't buy that many and they were able to save money this way, so they kept the cable shut off. You could also spring for a Netflix membership with streaming, I have it and enjoy it lots. Hulu Plus has a lot of followers too. You could also try DVDswap or buying used on Amazon for TV shows, etc. I haven't looked at this options but worth a shot.

    Good luck!

    Posted 1 year ago #
  6. Harmonica Charlie

    Novice
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 14

    @Jacob one book I now give away for free on my new blog to entice subscribers. I also wrote a poetry book via Lulu and I pulled it down because I screwed up the cover by making edits. I plan on taking some of those poems and add them to a new compilation that is more in line with me as an adult father.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  7. jennypenny

    Expert
    Joined: Jul '11
    Posts: 1,338

    Re: health insurance for kids-- the law now guarantees that you can get coverage for them but there is no cap on cost so it can be very high. Our state (like most) has a childrens health insurance program for low income families. In our state, once your child is diagnosed with a "catastrophic" illness they are eligible for the plan regardless of the family's income level. This is administered by the welfare dept in our state. You can apply even if you are currently covered by an employer- sponsored plan. I hope this is available to you.

    My husband doesn't want to retire because he has the same fears as your wife. He wants to wait until our son is 18 and could be covered by Medicare if he is disabled.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  8. George the original one

    Expert
    Joined: Jul '10
    Posts: 1,938

    I can't help but think having a management company take on the rentals would free you of stress while still delivering most of the income...

    Do not fight the wife on the house. It's not a fight you'd ever win and only brings resentment. That's not a terrible mortgage to have, so it should be an easy concession.

    Some habits should be shifted, refined. That's where your big savings will likely come from.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  9. KevinW

    Master
    Joined: Aug '10
    Posts: 576

    Your household's combination of a single wage income, looming layoffs, and inflexible expenses seems like a red-alert, five alarm emergency to me. It's time to spring into action!

    I'm just a stranger on the Internet but your introduction makes it sound like your wife has veto power over all these decisions. I think you guys are going to get better at making compromises. Relationships don't seem to be very durable when one person gets their way all the time.

    That said, from your wife's perspective you're proposing radical lifestyle changes all of a sudden, so it's not surprising that she's skeptical.

    The bootstrap business seems like a good idea but I'm not a fan of party-based sales. IMO those programs kind of trick people, generally economically vulnerable women, into underestimating their entrepreneurial potential. I wonder if your wife could take on a more ambitious business. Maybe she could run the rental houses as an incorporated business?

    Posted 1 year ago #
  10. bluepearl

    Journeyman
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 105

    Hi Charlie
    Welcome! I think you'll find that the community is very welcoming and helpful!

    RE: Real estates, I understand they are a lot of work, however, it appears that you are in a cash flow positive $50 per month situation, am I right? Based on the millionaire next door series most quiet affluent types either make their $ in real estates or store their wealth there. I also think that if you can refinance to lower rates (rates are at historic lows, but I am sure you already know that from your job) and make them even more cash flow positive that will help you reach FI sooner. And once you are FI, you have time to tend to the houses. Also, agree with Kevin, your wife can do some management work too.

    RE: spouse
    Don't listen to these intj engineer types tell you about women ;) Your wife will obviously take some adjustments, but if I were her I would feel that I already have 18 years of triple full time work cut out for me, therefore you are not having the easy way out! I guess if you can show how a reduction in spending can help all 5 of you (by being an example first by just cutting your own expenses), I am sure she will be on board very soon.

    I had an extremely thrifty dad and a spendy mom growing up, so I understand there will be some friction in the household.

    Oh, being appreciative of your wife daily will do wonders (say thank you, hugs...).

    Posted 1 year ago #
  11. Dragline

    Master
    Joined: Aug '11
    Posts: 959

    You guys sound like you are under a lot of stress, and no wonder with the kids and all. ERE probably sounds crazy to your wife right now, and both of you are likely to be short on the sleep end, which only magnifies things. We have 3 kids, too, but did not have them all at once. But even one at a time caused many sleepless nights for both of us.

    Whatever you decide to do, you both need to be on board. Money issues are the #1 conflict point in marriages.

    I would just focus on tracking your spending with your wife for a couple months. Then you can sit down together and decide the best approach. Attacking the debts and reducing the interest rates may be the first order of business. And selling the houses like you planned.

    You also may want to consider separating your bank accounts. My wife and I have always had separate, but linked joint bank accounts (no secrets). When she was working full-time, she would pay certain bills (kids clothes, food, etc.) and I would take care of other ones (mortgage, utilities, etc.). When she stopped working, we kept the accounts separate and I started paying her twice a month. The reason this is important is because it would allow you to save in your own accounts even if she doesn't. And it will force both of you to budget or face the embarrassment of having to ask the other to bail you out. Peer pressure on who's the most responsible with money.

    You will get a lot of good advice here, but mostly about finances and not about women. I learn something new here almost every day.

    But take your time. These decisions and your path are much different when you have dependents. Best of luck to you, Dad.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  12. George the original one

    Expert
    Joined: Jul '10
    Posts: 1,938

    I'm thinking the best way to win your wife over to ERE is by showing her how much income the family can have if you save hard for the next 5 years while the kids are less of a financial drain.

    Then, when the 5 years are up, she'll be used to a lower spending level and you can lead into the next stage. "That wasn't so bad, was it?"

    Right now, you both need to discuss the possibility of job loss and the need for having a cash fund to tide you over. After all, she doesn't want to lose the current house and that is a credible possibility if you are laid off.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  13. Suzanne

    Novice
    Joined: Jul '11
    Posts: 27

    Maybe your wife can't believe ERE is really a long term option? In that case, slowly cutting expenses will show the effect bit by bit. Maybe this could convince her.
    If it is about feeling overwelmed by the care of the kids she should realize that less working hours for you on the job is less 'working hours' for her with the kids and household. If you don't have to work full time you could help out with the kids and relieve that pressure a bit.

    I sure hope it is not really about the big house AND the cable AND the car AND... etc. because really, it is about living a good life with each other right? All the rest is just... stuff. Good luck on your path!

    Posted 1 year ago #
  14. Harmonica Charlie

    Novice
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 14

    Lots of terrific responses so far, thank you very much. Almost three weeks into tracking our spending and I am realizing that the giant gaping hole in our spending is me. I spend because I'm generally unhappy day to day. So I spend a lot on escapes, or new plans, like books, music gear, and various marketing training for Internet Businesses. If I can control these three areas for me, I think we are much better along to our goal. So it comes down to me being the example that I want to see in my small world (my family). Part of my problem is probably boredom. I cannot remember the last time I went out and just had a beer with the guys...three, four years, maybe? We had a rough pregnancy leading up to their birth, and I'm not particularly social to begin with, so I think I start blowing my money in other ways because something is unhappy inside of me.

    @KevinW - I see your point about the party business but I think it's a matter of time. Raising triplets is enormously time consuming, especially at the age they are at. So quite literally, she has an hour a day, during nap, to market and put thru orders. At night, I have an hour to write and do my small business. She seems very happy with it, except for feeling guilty about having to leave the kids for a couple hours to do a party. They are only this small once and it is such a joy to watch them grow and figure things out. I am amazed at the number of parties she's been able to book over the next two months. She is instantly more profitable than all the money I pour into my blog and SEO Copywriting business.

    @George the Original One (is there an impostor George?) - Job loss is on our minds a lot. My wife knows that I would like to become a writer and work for myself and I think that's part of the reason she's started this business, to help pay off debt and offset some of the income hit we may take should I leave or get RIF'd. Until I can show the ability to make money with my side business the conversation is moot because there is no realistic alternative to my day job right now.

    I like the idea of breaking things up into five year plans, George, thank you. As I said above, controlling my inability to delay instant gratification is foremost.

    I would not stop "working" per se, when I reached ERE. I would write non-fiction and fiction books, because that is what I love. I would do small gigs with a band or solo. These are creative outlets. The philosophical question is, if I love these things so much, why wait till ERE?

    @Dragline, interesting perspective on the separate accounts. She maintains a separate account for her business, but we hadn't considered separating again with the personal accounts. I wonder if she would trust the process. She seems to keep a keen eye on what I spend, and with good reason considering the hole I've caused with Gear Acquisition Syndrome.

    @bluepearl, I think our cashflow is even better than that. With $2700 a month coming in and only approximately $1500 going out in mortgages and a couple hundred more for quarterly bills, we actually are in an ideal rental area. I just don't want to do it anymore. My wife doesn't want to talk to tenants at all and I'm just way too nice for this business. I also feel weird about bringing in a Management company right now because some of the tenants work in my day job Company and they may be insulted by that or they may still bother me with stuff. I haven't raised rents in 9 years and my rents are way below the market. IF you are including our home mortage in that as well, then I am more inclined to agree.

    Can you see my personality so far? I can...I'm very wishy-washy which is why I'm in this mess.

    @jennypenny - yes I've learned more about health insurance in the last week or so by talking to other parents. I guess there is a Healthy Child NY plan as well which is very affordable. Not sure what we'd do for the wife and I, though, but I have some time to figure it out.

    I think tracking our spending and controling my spending urges are the two things to concentrate on over the next couple of months.

    Thanks again, everyone,

    - Charlie

    Posted 1 year ago #
  15. Harmonica Charlie

    Novice
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 14

    Also, I think I have to switch gears for October and start funding an emergency fund, instead of throwing all the money at the credit cards. I know that I have a couple of necessary repairs to the rental properties to make before winter, chief among them is some damage to the driveway concrete caused by big ole' tree roots over time. It's a major danger if those spots get covered in snow before they are fixed.

    I don't have the money in Savings to cover this and repairs to doors caused by wind damage and the glass block windows I've been promising another tenant for the basement.

    - Charlie

    Posted 1 year ago #
  16. palmera

    Journeyman
    Joined: Aug '11
    Posts: 270

    Hey Harmonica Charlie, everyone here as already given you great advice with regards to your relationship with your wife. Only thing I can say is that I can only imagine what it's like for your wife taking care of THREE babies. THREE!!!

    I'm an aunt to (hyperactive) twins. I remember spending days and weekends with them, helping mom out when they were infants/toddlers. Even a simple outing to the grocery store or park was a huge mission and *I* came home drained, so mum must have been completely wiped. Having twins isn't double the work, it's probably more than that, so much respect to your wife (and you;) for triplets.

    You took a very important first step by analyzing your income and outflows to realize the savings could start with you.

    Good luck, keep it up and remember, convincing your wife will probably take baby steps.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  17. George the original one

    Expert
    Joined: Jul '10
    Posts: 1,938

    > @George the Original One (is there an impostor George?)

    Before the forum, I would post as "George" in the comments. Then I started reading posts by "George" that sounded like something I'd write, but I didn't remember writing them.

    Finally, after about 4 or 5 episodes of memory blankness, it dawned on me that there were two of us writing as "George"... so I switched to "George the original one" and he caught on to the joke, switching to "George the other one" and then Jacob created the forum, so we kept our identities.

    "the other one" is younger and more hip than I am.

    Now there's a third person on the forum known simply as "George" or "george".

    Posted 1 year ago #
  18. justjohn

    Apprentice
    Joined: Aug '11
    Posts: 40

    Charlie, my first suggestion would be regarding the cable. Have you thought about an over-the-air antenna? We basically never had cable, once we married (30 years now) Mostly my wife's idea, but we have saved thousand$.

    Just using rabbit ears we receive all the major networks (abc, cbs, nbc, fox, pbs). Combined with Netflix & some youtube/hulu, I don't feel that we are missing much. You can look at a site like tvfool.com to see what your prospects are. Perhaps you can even pull in a canadian station for more variety.

    I guess my other thought is to just enjoy the triplets and try to track expenses for now.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  19. bluepearl

    Journeyman
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 105

    @Harmonica Charlie
    Bravo! From "I honestly feel like a human ATM at times" to "it comes down to me being the example that I want to see in my small world (my family)" in a week I see an remarkable level of self reflection, your family's road to ERE will be smoother than you expect!

    @George the Original One
    Hmmm... I didn't know about this alias story... keep calling you George when you commented on my post, will be more specific down the road...

    Posted 1 year ago #
  20. ZAForumite

    Novice
    Joined: Oct '11
    Posts: 1

    Hi Charlie

    So it was your post above that made me take the step from lurker to contributor!

    I can identify with a lot of myself in your response about the properties. I'm your stereotypical nice guy, and I spent my high school, University, and beginning of my working career being taken advantage of. Eventually, I realised that this was not only hugely self destructive to me, but that it lessened my ability to make a real impact on the world, and to help the people I really wanted to help. I was dropping things such as volunteering and charitable contributions because I couldn't say "no" to people in other areas of my life. Eventually, something had to give.

    I made 2010 "the year of no" - I stuck this on my monitor at work, and remembered it every time someone asked me for a favour. Instead of a default "yes, sure, why not", my default became "no". I would then need to either persuade myself that it was a good idea, and really the best thing I could be doing, or the individual would have to try and persuade me. I learnt a few things:

    1. Often, the cost to me of helping was much higher than the cost to the individual of me not helping. Before, I had a fear of people being crushed by life if I didn't help them out - now, I realised that many people are taking a flyer and asking because you might say yes.

    2. By saying no that often, I built up the time and space in my life to say yes to the things that really mattered, and to be able to help out people in a powerful and meaningful way.

    I would suggest to you that you hold onto those properties - if you can pay a couple hundred dollars additional in every month, you will start paying down your mortgages surprisingly quickly. And then approach each of your tenants, one on one - tell them how much you appreciate them having rented from you, that you want to maintain the relationship, but that because of family responsibilities you can't manage the properties yourself. Also, tell them that you are under major financial pressure and that the rent will need to start slowly escalating towards market related rates. 99% of people out there will respond graciously and understandingly to this - sure, they will still call you occasionally, but most of those calls you will be able to simply pass on to the managing agents. And the few cases where you do have to be involved (because the management company has dropped the ball) will be much less of a stress. And the 1% of people who respond poorly to this, well, to be honest they are jackasses and you shouldn't sacrifice your own dreams and financial goals in order to subsidise their rentals!

    One more thing - remember, by giving these people a subsidised rental you doing one of two things - either reinforcing their own bad habits and allowing them to live above their means, or you are subsidising their own savings. Neither of these are a good thing!

    Good luck with your journey and goals - while it's a tough situation you are in because of your kids medical needs, it's not an insurmountable one.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  21. 4444

    Apprentice
    Joined: Nov '10
    Posts: 57

    I am a triplet. We were all born under 2 lbs a month early (and we are 2 boys and a girl) :)

    Posted 1 year ago #
  22. Marlene

    Journeyman
    Joined: Aug '11
    Posts: 150

    For peaceful communication I´d recommend "Peacetalk 101" from Suzette Haden Elgin, which is a novel and to me was a gripping read.

    Posted 11 months ago #
  23. secretwealth

    Expert
    Joined: Jun '11
    Posts: 1,503

    No amount of training in peaceful communication will help when a relationship is based upon one person using another person for financial gain. I'm not saying that this is the case with the OP and his wife--but I do want to point out that communication skills are limited.

    Posted 11 months ago #
  24. Marlene

    Journeyman
    Joined: Aug '11
    Posts: 150

    Agreed - sorry if my comment came over like this!

    Posted 11 months ago #
  25. Christopherjart

    Journeyman
    Joined: Apr '12
    Posts: 191

    wow, what a fascinating journal. I'm still amazed. You have this amazingly high income plus rental income so you have an ideal situation.
    If you could just stop overspending you could be ready for early retirement in just a few years.

    As for your wife, I think perhaps instead of encouraging early retirement, you could encourage financial freedom and being prepared for emergencies. Of course, if that works and you happen to have enough to retire after a few years, then you can discuss retirement at that point.

    Posted 11 months ago #
  26. Harmonica Charlie

    Novice
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 14

    I wish I could say I've made a ton of progress since I last posted. I lurk on the boards at least a couple days a week, but I actually don't see any way I can retire early unless I somehow get a passive income stream from real estate and/or royalties from books to replace all or most of my current $132K income. I managed to pay off a car and get another raise since I last posted but we constantly run the cards up and pay them down.

    And so I think the situation is untenable and I worry that I will have to give up on retiring early. The best thing that could happen to me right now, in this regard, is to get fired...and I'm only half-joking. I think that would put things in perspective as to what's important to spend money on.

    So I at least got my wife to start tracking again this month. The issues before would be I would track and she would forget and since she's doing most of the shopping for the kids and the house, her piece is just as important as me writing the checks for the bills. She's willing because I think she wants to find money holes so that we can buy other things like a new car since we have just the one that can fit three toddler car seats, and my vehicle is ten years old, can't fit the car seats, and I've had two substantially expensive repairs in the last six weeks.

    I'm sorry, I'm just in a different universe than ERE right now, and it pains me to no end. I literally don't have $50 at the end of the month to invest right now (though I do contribute 11% to my 401K and my company matches 6%) and can't imagine amassing substantial dividend income ever in my lifetime.

    For my own role in this, I can see that I have had some expenses with Triathlon races and bike setup that I wouldn't have if I hadn't taken up this hobby to get in shape and have fun. I was encouraged to get back into this by my wife who actually very kindly and unexpectedly bought me a Triathlon bike with some of the money she saved up from a little side business she has selling organizational bags and totes. I paid for a bike fitting, water bottle attachments, bike shoes since these have special toe clips and aren't like a normal pedal at all, a flat tire kit and a bike pump.

    Still spending too much on books. Everytime someone recommends something on these boards I tend to buy it (Epictetus) and whoever started the Books thread...damn you!!!

    Two of the triplets (my boys) have both been diagnosed as autistic and so there's more therapies, more tests, my health insurance covers less this year and that will be the coming trend. It is certainly possible that we may always have to care for them. I'm not being pessimistic in that regard. We've been told by the boys' therapists to begin preparing for this.

    I think the first $4500 or $5500 is out of pocket for health insurance now and so I'm getting multiple $200 and $300 bills each month. I've been paying for some ancillary things just to see how they will do with normal activities and normal kids their age, like tiny tots soccer, and some other activities for them. If anything, even though this is ancillary, I think it's very important for them right now and should take precendence over books and me doing triathlon stuff.

    Credit Card = $4134, so better than 8 months ago, for sure...but still a see-saw.

    Auto Minivan = Paid off with an annual work bonus.

    Rental House #1 Mortgage/HELOC = $25,603 (duplex that gets $665 in monthly rents). Yep, it went up. Had some structural repairs to do and didn't have the money or skills...

    Rental House #2 Mortgage - $47,886 (duplex that gets $975 in monthly rents)

    Rental House #3 Mortgage = $53,219 (duplex that gets $810 in monthly rents)

    Primary Residence Mortgage = $127,329

    Total Outstanding Debt: $254,658

    So we've knocked down $27,899 in debt in the last 8 months. It's the see-saw of the credit cards that's keeping me from building up an emergency fund and having money to invest and this is all caused by our inability to prioritize.

    I waver between wanting to save for investing in stocks, and aggressively paying down those mortgages so that I'll have some passive income. I would like to see if anyone has opinions on that.

    I wrote another book and published on Amazon since my last posting but other than a mild spike when I first released it, it hardly sells anything.

    We hadn't been tracking spending for the last six months, so I'm actually slightly pleased to see the debt number come down a bit, but not nearly as impressive as many of the other journals on here.

    Thank you all for your responses. @Christopherjart, you're right, I should try to sell the financial freedom, but my wife already has that with me working and her staying at home. Now it's, "well if we can put away some money, we can get a vacation home at Sherkston Shores..."

    I also have graver concerns for my job. I work for a financial institution that has quite publicly made moves to shrink its footprint in the US, and, in fact, it no longer has a footprint at all in my area. The problem is, that my inquiries into similar positions with other financial institutions in the area put the salary 20-30% lower than I am currently making...and they aren't hiring people away...they're just plucking the people who get let go here and who are desparate and paying them less. Such is life in the second poorest city in the US...

    Posted 11 months ago #
  27. Posthumane

    Novice
    Joined: Nov '11
    Posts: 29

    I would say your best option right now is to start aggressively paying down your rental property mortgages. From a mathematical point of view it might not yield the greatest return, compared to other potential investments, but since you and your wife don't seem to have the discipline to keep a substantial saving it may be best to put the money into something where you can't easily take it back out again. Once one of your rentals is paid down your cash flow will increase, so it would be best to try to put all of that extra towards another mortgage right away before you get used to having it. 28k in debt repayment in 8 months is not bad at all. Debt repayment is a form of savings after all. Extrapolating that, if you can keep up that rate you will save/pay down about 42k/year.

    Also, I agree about not trying to sell your wife too hard on early retirement - most people don't understand early retirement (the how or the why). But do try to sell her on financial security by being less dependent on your job. If you pay down your mortgages to increase passive income (and have them externally managed if you don't want to deal with the hassle) you won't be struck as hard if you do get laid off.

    Posted 11 months ago #
  28. riparian

    Master
    Joined: Oct '11
    Posts: 341

    If your children are disabled aren't they eligible for social security and medicaid? According to my calculations you're sitting on $12-1800/m in kids.

    Anyways, here comes that tough love you were looking for:

    Your wife treats you like an ATM and won't give up cable and it's all her fault you can't ERE but you're actually the money hole. But wait, that's her fault too! You wouldn't buy so much Stuff if you weren't unhappy and bored!

    You've made a profitable real estate investment but you want to sell out of it cause it's too hard and you're too nice to raise the rent. You'd rather spend your time writin poetry ebooks that don't sell.

    How do you even get a job like you have with that kind of logical ability?

    You should obviously do the most immediate, obvious thing and raise the rents to something reasonable. Then learn to use the library.

    Posted 11 months ago #
  29. Christopherjart

    Journeyman
    Joined: Apr '12
    Posts: 191

    yes, you have an amazing income, so if she asks why you are worried about financial freedom (instead of early retirement), ask her "what If I lost my job?" That would put things in perspective.

    I agree that paying off those investment property mortgages is also a form of savings. If you spend all available cash every month then that would be a good option.

    Posted 11 months ago #
  30. Harmonica Charlie

    Novice
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 14

    Hi @riparian, thank you for your response. The children qualified for something called presumptive social security disability due to the low birth weight. Haven't the foggiest where you're getting 12-1800 a month as a number. They got $30 a month from the Fed and $5 from the state each month and then finally got a lifetime payout around one year of age of $700 a piece. The reasoning I suppose is that they will likely catch up by school age, and I think my daughter will, but I think the boys will have a tougher road due to the autism.

    After the first month, I never cashed those checks because I felt that with my income, I didn't deserve it and the only reason we went through it is the one NICU nurse set up the appointment for us and was insistent about getting whatever help we could, and we were first time parents who were overwhelmed with three new babies. They also highly encouraged us to apply for WIC, but I did not. I see people in my city every day that need the money more than me. If that makes me an idiot for not wanting to take government money, then so be it, I can live with that...which probably exposes a mental block I have for accepting free money, getting more than I feel I deserve, and also for asking people to buy my books and music.

    You are quite correct about the books. That is something I am working on now. I'm not sure I ever claimed to buy stuff because my wife's spending makes me miserable. I think I mentioned boredom as a reason several months ago. Maybe I alluded to it, I don't know. Too tired to read all the way back at the moment.

    I'd also say that I use books as research for writing, I can't remember the last time I read a novel and quite frankly, the local library system doesn't tend to carry or is interested in carrying the more esoteric books I special order, though I could have probably have found a copy of Epictetus and some of the books from the Books thread rather easily.

    Bottom line is that I'm actively addressing it and recognizing it as a trouble spot, so thank you for the reminder. I have enough to read for a few years (slow reader since I study, mark up and take extensive notes from my books) and have no excuse for buying anything new.

    I can see the opinion on the poetry books. I wrote one and mentioned in a prior post that I was going to compile another but instead I've actually published three non-fiction books since that time. I'm probably not selling much because I'm not very good at it, yet, and am struggling to stick out on the web, but I love it so that is why I do it.

    The comment about my job kinda tweaked me, sorry. Questioning my "logical ability"...I donno, it is barely short of name-calling, or perhaps I'm reading it wrong. I didn't just "get a job" like I have. I worked my way up from an entry-level customer service position by working very hard, giving up a lot of nights and weekends and doing whatever was asked for twelve years. It's a very analytical job that I have now in Compliance. I analyze federal and state financial laws all day, and work with areas and systems of a global bank to comply with them. Given the intense regulatory scrutiny in the last five years, it is generally demanding and stressful and requires a lot of face time with government regulators. It takes someone with a cool head and even disposition which I seem to have at work. So to me, it's quite logical that I'd want to indulge my artistic side in my downtime by writing books and music.

    At the moment, I don't want to sell out of the real estate, but that tends to change depending on the current relationship with the tenants.

    The simple realization that I've had after writing all of this down and analyzing it is that it's clear that I do anything possible to avoid conflict in my non-work life, since all I do everyday at work is deal with conflict. I get in the shark tank all the time with Regulators who smell blood. That inability to say No at home, or to be tougher with tenants, even in my own actions and buying decisions is why I am at, where I am at, I think.

    Oh and I did raise the rents slightly at the beginning of this year, finally. Thx to all for that advice. Still under market, but I have a couple subsidized tenants and Belmont won't let me go up more than 1-2% per year.

    One step at a time...

    Posted 11 months ago #
  31. riparian

    Master
    Joined: Oct '11
    Posts: 341

    Charlie, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to insult you, only to get you to examine your choices.

    If you reapply for SS with the autism diagnosis' they will determine them to be X% disabled, and then they will get that % of the standard disability payment. In my experience that's usually around $5-600 for autism, but it depends on the degree to which they're affected.

    The library where I live is 1 room, 12 shelves, but they have this thing called inter library loan. I bet your library does too! You can get almost any book in the world, as long as another library has it. It's also good incentive to get those books read.

    Let me try to rephrase what came across as insulting before: you're in dire financial straights with a big income, big expenses, no savings, and a job that might go poof. Does it make more sense to invest your time and money in your business that has been profitable and promises to be much more profitable when you pay off the mortgages, or does it make more sense to keep investing time and money in a business that hasn't been profitable? I myself have published a poetry ebook on LuLu, by the way.

    Posted 11 months ago #
  32. Harmonica Charlie

    Novice
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 14

    Oh ok, @riparian, I understand now. No worries, it's all good. Thank you for clarifying.

    I think that if I put a kabash on any more book spending that brings my costs of running my "Business" which is essentially a wordpress blog with articles and links to my books on Amazon, near zero, except for yearly web hosting and domain name registration.

    Unfortunately I did buy some books earlier this month so they will show up in the tallies for June.

    Posted 11 months ago #
  33. Harmonica Charlie

    Novice
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 14

    And I think my wife is very aware of the dire straits of my means of employment. She, too, worked for the company before becoming an instant stay at home mom with triplets. I think we've both been burying our heads in the sand a bit...like if we ignore the 800 lb gorilla in the room maybe it won't rip our limbs off and stuff them down our throats.

    Obviously there are problems with that line of thinking...

    Posted 11 months ago #
  34. secretwealth

    Expert
    Joined: Jun '11
    Posts: 1,503

    Honestly, Charlie, I think you are too nice and your wife isn't nice enough. Since you're a lover of poetry, there is a line in Chaucer--"unhardy is unseemly", which is Middle English for "the timid are unlucky". You might want to consider that.

    Posted 11 months ago #
  35. bluepearl

    Journeyman
    Joined: Sep '11
    Posts: 105

    Charlie -
    May I suggest cancelling all the credit cards (not just cutting them up or putting them in the freezer, b/c you will still be able to buy stuff online).

    Then use your salary to pay down the mortgages aggressively as suggested by other forum members.

    Credit cards are not a necessity. For emergencies, use cash or debit cards. You’ll be amazed how much more prudent your spending decisions will be once you have to hand out cash. I am not frugal by nature, (window) shopping is actually a favorite pastime of mine, and cancelling the cards work for me. Your wife may be too busy to document spendings, set up a pricebook etc., but assuming she’s a responsible person (and it sounds like she is), I bet having her use cash/ debit card (must ensure no overdraft occurs) will reduce frivolous spendings.

    Oh, I don’t know if I have recommended this site before, but I really enjoyed reading the prudent homemaker. Brandie (super inspirational) has 7 kids, and her hubby is a real estate agent in Vegas (huge salary cuts in the last few years). I would suggest at least adopting some of the tips that work for your situation, given that you are also facing some uncertainties.
    http://www.theprudenthomemaker.com/
    Good luck.

    Posted 11 months ago #
  36. Mo

    Master
    Joined: Jul '10
    Posts: 442

    @HC, perhaps I can inject a bit of optimism into the thread here... Maybe I'm wrong, but over the past 8 months, you've knocked $3500/mo off of your debts. If your current outstanding debt level is $255k, at you're current rate, you'll be debt free in 6 years.

    At that point, you'll have what appears to be at least $300k in real estate, including your primary residence, and cash flow from the rentals of $2500/mo. You're also saving roughly $17k per year in your 401k, meaning you should have an additional $120k+ in the 401k on top of whatever you have now.

    I'm not saying you'll have enough to retire, but a paid off house, $2500/mo in income, and $120k + whatever, is certainly on the right path.

    A few other thoughts:
    You're supporting 5 people on your salary, and due to your relationship with your wife, which you obviously value, there isn't a quick way for you to dramatically slash your housing costs... so if you are earning $100k per year pre-tax, supporting 5 people, putting $11k into the 401k, and paying down debt in post-tax dollars by $3500/mo-- that's pretty tight.

    Applying for the appropriate disability status for your children seems essential given the uncertainty of your employment. If you apply today, you might not be approved for 4-6 months, so don't wait until it's an emergency.

    Your comment about not wanting to take government money because there are people who need money more than you is incredibly kind hearted, but also naive. Our government is not perfect, and it certainly doesn't award money or tax breaks based on need alone. There are plenty of people with need who aren't sufficiently helped and plenty without need who are. Perhaps you could see a more tangible positive impact by optimizing your own situation, and then using your own excess to directly help a person with unmet need, rather than hoping that our government will justly distribute the dollars you don't claim.

    Posted 11 months ago #

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