Early Retirement Extreme Forums

Early Retirement Extreme Forums » DIY Skills Questions

1. 

   northman
   

   Apprentice
   Joined: Mar '11
   Posts: 54

   I`m wondering, thinking about going back to school in a year, maybe two. Just for the fun of it, and because its free.

   I was trying to figure out what types of education would be useful for society or myself. I`m thinking about engineering or.. well mostly engineering since I have always wanted to be one.

   I don`t see the real value of studying sociology or dance, or history.. I see those more as fun subjects, and what people could read in their spare time.

   What other subjects I have thought of:
   -law: don`t go to well across borders
   -economics: mostly about streamlining a company, reducing costs (in most countries = sees workers as inputs, not resources.)

   So, I have kind of stranded on engineering. So, I want to ask you, what type of engineer would you be if you did it all over, and why? What jobs?

   Me: production/mechanical engineer, how to produce things more efficient. Maybe that don`t go to well with the ERE mantra of producing "cheap trinkets", but it sure fascinates me. I would want to produce high tech stuff.. CNC-machines all over the place producing highly complex "stuff". :)

   Posted 1 year ago #
2. 

   dot_com_vet
   

   Master
   Joined: Jan '11
   Posts: 377

   I'd recommend railroad engineer. :-)

   J/K, I like the idea of mechanical engineering. None of my friends in the field have ever been unemployed. Definitely a great idea, and much better than dance.

   Posted 1 year ago #
3. 

   dragoncar
   

   Expert
   Joined: Oct '10
   Posts: 1,289

   For ere, I'd say civil engineering would be most useful. Sure, mechE can teach you CBC, but you don't need an entire engineering program for that. A rapid prototyping class would probably be nice.

   Posted 1 year ago #
4. 

   Hoplite
   

   Master
   Joined: Dec '10
   Posts: 489

   Mechanical engineering is the most jack-of-all-trades of engineering degrees and probably the most useful all around. Of course you get an argument from the chemical engineers :)

   Otherwise, it depends on personal preference. I think that for achieving ERE, a good degree would be in marine engineering. The pay is high, and if you like ships or at least can stand being cooped up on a ship for months at a time, you can't spend the money and your living expenses while on board are covered.

   Posted 1 year ago #
5. 

   S
   

   Journeyman
   Joined: Jul '10
   Posts: 288

   I'm a software engineer and it suits me more than most jobs would I think. There's good opportunity to work freelance or contract for partial income when ERE or you can make the world a better place writing open source software.

   Posted 1 year ago #
6. 

   KevinW
   

   Master
   Joined: Aug '10
   Posts: 577

   IMO a modern Renaissance man/woman will be most dependent on mechanical devices and software. So I would be formally trained in one and self-taught in the other. I'm formally trained in computer science / software engineering and fancy myself a self-taught mechanic. It's worked out well for me. Alternatively one could major in mechanical engineering and teach themselves computer programming. Both careers seem lucrative enough to make it to ERE.

   Posted 1 year ago #
7. 

   George the original one
   

   Expert
   Joined: Jul '10
   Posts: 1,941

   Civil or mechanical engineering are the most portable, but they may also be the most commoditized careers after software engineering.

   In one sense, engineering careers are some of the least reliable as they rely on an economy moving forward with projects.

   Posted 1 year ago #
8. 

   RightClawSouth
   

   Journeyman
   Joined: Jul '10
   Posts: 122

   Software engineer +1

   I liked Akratic's solution here:
   http://forum.earlyretirementextreme.com/topic.php?id=532#post-6424

   Posted 1 year ago #
9. 

   mikeBOS
   

   Master
   Joined: Nov '10
   Posts: 554

   Astronautical Engineering!

   That way you could go join one of those amateur rocketry groups and help them get a satellite up into orbit on a boot-strapped budget like they've been trying to do for 20 years. Sounds like a nice way to spend a retirement.

   Posted 1 year ago #
10. 

    dot_com_vet
    

    Master
    Joined: Jan '11
    Posts: 377

    Regarding Aktratic's proposal of trying to cash in at a startup, that's an interesting reading plan. Having worked for three startups that fizzled, it's still a gamble that anything will make one rich. And shunning VC's isn't going to help either. The odds of success are probably 1/5000 not 1/10.

    Still nothing to lose, so why not try. And falling back on $50-$150/hour consulting gigs is easy. Software engineering is doing well now.

    ------------------------------
    I liked Akratic's solution here:
    http://forum.earlyretirementextreme.com/topic.php?id=532#post-6424

    Posted 1 year ago #
11. 

    jacob
    

    Expert
    Joined: Jul '10
    Posts: 3,298

    Who me? EE! I got mad number/computer/simulation skills, so it seems like a natural fit.

    For ERE (DIY), I think mechanical engineering is the most useful as long as you learn to build your designs as well. Merely being able to make a CAD drawing is rather useless in my opinion.

    It also seems to be the easiest branch of engineering because you can tell what's going on just by looking at it.

    FWIW: If engineering looks at "how", physics looks at "why". A standard physics degree typically progresses like this.
    1st year: Mechanics, Thermodynamics (17th century-19th century)
    2nd year: Electrodynamics, quantum mechanics (1870-1930)
    3rd year: atomic, nuclear, solid state, astrophysics (1930-1960)
    4th year: quantum field theory, particle physics, ... (1960-1980)
    5th year and beyond: Thesis work. (1980-now)

    Posted 1 year ago #
12. 

    Surio
    

    Sorcerer
    Joined: Dec '10
    Posts: 601

    As a Mechanical/Computer Engineer, I am biased towards Mechanical all the time ;-). Of course Jacob's point of Electrical Engineering is a close second as these two fields go hand in hand in an ERE (DIY) scenario towards recreating subset of modern livings on an appropriate scale.

    @Hoplite,
    I used to help my Chem Eng friends with their work in many of the semesters, so it would be fair to say Chem Eng is subsumed by Mech Eng. I've liked some of their plant economics topics and had read them up for fun so and northman could probably do the same.

    Posted 1 year ago #
13. 

    Hoplite
    

    Master
    Joined: Dec '10
    Posts: 489

    Surio,
    "it would be fair to say Chem Eng is subsumed by Mech Eng" Agreed but my chem friends would not, though I still like to make fun of them for drawing pictures of molecules :)

    No matter which route taken, I think that some physical chemistry is useful, maybe two semesters worth at most. Beyond that, as you say, you can read on your own.

    The real problem with chemistry, as I see it, is that outside of academia or government labs, many end up either working for an oil company or in some consumer product division. A 30 year career in mouthwash, for example, or perhaps fruit juice box linings. The horror.

    Posted 1 year ago #
14. 

    bigato
    

    Master
    Joined: Mar '11
    Posts: 921

    You said you want it just for fun. Try to take a look at some real engineers working, talk to them, see how is their typical work day. After that, just follow your guts, you can't go wrong. If you just talk to engineers on the net, you sure will make a mistake. Go see the real thing.

    Posted 1 year ago #
15. 

    crazn
    

    Novice
    Joined: May '11
    Posts: 22

    I am a Mechanical Engineer, licensed in about 30 states. I tried agricultural, electrical, and chemical engineering in college but I landed in mechanical. It suits my brain the best. Sample them all and then select - it worked for me.

    Posted 1 year ago #
16. 

    rePete
    

    Journeyman
    Joined: Jul '10
    Posts: 278

    I'd go for EE (for the math and abstract lover) or ME (for the hands on lover). The downside with ChE is that many of the jobs are in the boonies, to reduce the risk of possible chemical pollution. Not to say there is anything wrong with the boonies, but I like options.

    FWIW, I spent the first two years after ChE in a EE lab and the next four branching into ME.

    Posted 1 year ago #
17. 

    chilly
    

    Journeyman
    Joined: Dec '10
    Posts: 275

    To me, software engineering is something you'd be much more likely to be able to self teach. It's a developer with a good architectural and algorithmic understanding that I believe could easily come with experience.

    EE, ME, CHE would all be much less realistic to do without schooling (not to mention you'd likely never get a job or certification).

    I've been an ME and a Software Engineer, but not an EE.

    And I second what others have said - try them or really figure out what they each do... you will probably find one more appealing. I like ME because it's like practical physics and you really understand a lot about how the physical world works when you are done.

    Posted 1 year ago #
18. 

    Andre900
    

    Apprentice
    Joined: Mar '11
    Posts: 79

    Yep, like Bigato and others said, watching what real working engineers do day-to-day would help in deciding which field to study. I earned a BS in Computer Science in 1986 and worked as a Software Engineer for four years. I was an excellent and top Computer Science student, but just an average Software Engineer. I'm not sure software engineers can really be called engineers. Perhaps, software developer and programmer are more accurate job titles.

    I eventually earned an MBA and transitioned into accounting and finance. Engineering doesn't interest me too much.

    Posted 1 year ago #
19. 

    hickchick
    

    Journeyman
    Joined: Jul '10
    Posts: 142

    As an ME graduate, I'd say I'd like best to be an employed engineer.

    Seriously, am I the only one that knows engineers on the long term unemployed list? Cause I know several, verging on a lot.

    Posted 1 year ago #
20. 

    JerseyGirl
    

    Novice
    Joined: Jun '11
    Posts: 21

    Northman, you mentioned that your schooling will be free. Where do you live, that you can get your degree for free? What an awesome opportunity you have.

    Posted 1 year ago #
21. 

    northman
    

    Apprentice
    Joined: Mar '11
    Posts: 54

    Norway.. you compete with your scores from high school.

    Ex. 6 is the best grade. To become a Doctor, you have to have 6.8. So you get additional points for military service, math, psychics, biology, 3 language etc etc..

    I`m not sure which school you are in, but our Universities has lots of exchange programs with American colleges. If not, you could apply on your own. Usually there are tons of available engineering courses. You could probably do a 4 years here for free... depending on your school, tuition, etc etc

    Posted 1 year ago #
22. 

    JerseyGirl
    

    Novice
    Joined: Jun '11
    Posts: 21

    ^^ So you get health care and education too! (burning up with jealousy)

    Posted 1 year ago #
23. 

    northman
    

    Apprentice
    Joined: Mar '11
    Posts: 54

    I think half the population is on welfare, but we are still the best economy in the EU. Haha.. :-9

    Posted 1 year ago #
24. 

    AlexK
    

    Journeyman
    Joined: Jul '10
    Posts: 115

    I'm an ME and it has worked out well. I work at a small R&D facility. A typical day for me involves drawing something up in Solidworks, going over to the lathe and mill and making it, then hooking it up and recording data of some kind.

    I like my job and coworkers, if I could somehow be a part time engineer I would not seek retirement. I get to satisfy my urge to build things and somebody else pays for the tools and materials.

    One thing I don't like is the trend for engineers to become managers. If you let them, your bosses will push for more and more management responsibility. You will spend more time in meetings and answering emails than getting hands dirty. I had to put a stop to it which is career suicide but good for the creative soul.

    Posted 1 year ago #
25. 

    northman
    

    Apprentice
    Joined: Mar '11
    Posts: 54

    JerseyGirl: Am I wrong, but I once read you are going back to school? What degree?

    AlexK: sounds like an AWESOME job.. no kidding, but it sounds like so much fun!

    Posted 1 year ago #
26. 

    paxprobellum
    

    Apprentice
    Joined: May '11
    Posts: 77

    @AlexK
    >> One thing I don't like is the trend for
    >> engineers to become managers.

    Yup. The worst part is that good engineers CAN be good managers, but generally aren't =/

    Posted 1 year ago #
27. 

    dragoncar
    

    Expert
    Joined: Oct '10
    Posts: 1,289

    @AlexK
    >> One thing I don't like is the trend for
    >> engineers to become managers.

    This is why I left engineering... there was nobody there 20 years my senior doing a job I wanted to be doing (either management or some extremely niche position... ok there might have been one or two jobs I'd like, but the competition would make shooting for that very risky).

    I didn't really say why I thought CivE was best for ERE -- mostly because it seems the most interdisciplinary to me, which is a part of ERE.

    Posted 1 year ago #
28. 

    anastrophe
    

    Novice
    Joined: Jul '11
    Posts: 27

    I think I want to be a civil engineer. I predict a lot of failing bridges and other infrastructure in the coming years and I have an analytical mind--but I don't have the required math/science skills to get into any programs. I regret I didn't take them as an undergraduate.

    Posted 1 year ago #
29. 

    tjt
    

    Journeyman
    Joined: Mar '11
    Posts: 127

    (I'm an EE)

    If EE is something that interests you, it can make a lot of money very fast. In the server/storage/networking field, with a few years of experience you can make $100K/year. If your goal is to make a lot of money fast for ERE, this is a good field.

    With all that said, don't choose a field you won't enjoy just for the money. I loved EE'ing for many years, but as I've grown tired of the discipline, it's not worth the money to do something you don't enjoy.

    Posted 1 year ago #
30. 

    mikeBOS
    

    Master
    Joined: Nov '10
    Posts: 554

    @tjt I dunno, with ERE the "do something you like" advice changes. It's not like you'll be stuck in the career for decades. It's more a question of: Do something low-paying that you kind of enjoy for 10 years, or do something high-paying that you hate for 3 years...

    Posted 1 year ago #
31. 

    jeremymday
    

    Journeyman
    Joined: Oct '10
    Posts: 132

    I like Mike's answer. There is something to be said for making as much money as you can as fast as you can, IF you plan to ERE, and it suits your disposition.

    Posted 1 year ago #
32. 

    rtw
    

    Novice
    Joined: Jul '11
    Posts: 4

    I am a Chemical engineer. If I were to do it over again, I would either go with mechanical, electrical, or computer engineering. Chemical engineering teaches you to problem solve, but you really don't get to apply it day to day. I stopped doing work in that field about 14 years ago. I moved into sales and have stayed there since.

    Posted 1 year ago #
33. 

    chemkrafty
    

    Novice
    Joined: Jul '10
    Posts: 15

    It was interesting reading the replies. I am a chemical engineer as well. I would say many chemical engineers end up as "process engineers" and do problem solving and optimization of processes. I echo many of the general sentiments here but believe chemeng to be just as broadly based as ME or CE as there are chemeng working on materials, aerospace, and many other disciplines.

    My biggest agreement and reason for seeking ERE or ER is AlexK's observation. At my company, engineers are pushed into project leadership, project managers, or management roles. Very few reach the upper levels of technical work as they don't need everyone to be a big thinker. Even these people spend most of their time mentoring younger engineers (management?).

    The best description of engineering in general that I have heard is that the product being produced by engineers is paperwork! If you don't like reports, memos, plans, reports, schedules, plans, reports, MEETINGS, pointless meetings, reports, and plans, then you shouldn't seek out engineering. I just wish they had told me this part in school!

    Posted 1 year ago #
34. 

    rtw
    

    Novice
    Joined: Jul '11
    Posts: 4

    @chemkrafty - I have not been in the engineering field for some time. The point you made about process optimization is basically what I learned. I alway felt mechanical engineering would give you the most experience in how machinery operate, which would be important in everyday life and make you more resourceful. I am not afraid to take something a part, and usually can repair items, but I just felt like what my friends in MechE did was more useful day to day.

    Posted 1 year ago #
35. 

    Seabourne
    

    Novice
    Joined: Jul '10
    Posts: 25

    Well, I majored in Mechanical Engineering and Economics (minor in models and data analysis... sort of seems like I was studying for ERE), and I've ended up working for a Civil firm, starting out with high speed rail design, then moving (with a layoff and hire-back) into transportation - mostly highways and such, with a few years of construction when they ran shorthanded. I would recommend civil for employment purposes, but it can be painfully boring. I ended up ME rather than EE (about 2 classes difference in what I took) because I liked to break/burn things :-)

    The work isn't hard, and that can be a problem for a certain sort of person, but the jobs are there. Its probably one of the more mobile professions in the US, and has a great practical grounding, but doesn't pay as well as other branches. Doing it all over, I would consider going into finance (strongly considered when I graduated) with a focus on engineering firms or industries, where being an engineer would be a real advantage compared to peers.

    Posted 1 year ago #
36. 

    george
    

    Journeyman
    Joined: Mar '11
    Posts: 211

    I know an electrical. mechanical, civil and agricultural engineer. By far the biggest earner and the socially most important role is the electrical engineer. He has been making sure thousands of people have power after a disaster, during a winter. Whatever you decide, try and specialise in areas that aren't popular among students ie high voltage engineering as opposed to consumer products. Also recommend mixing it with business experience.

    BTW I did Economics, it's not all about business, I found it really interesting, we seem to have been conned into believing economics is the free market milton friedman rubbish. But you don't have to do a degree to understand it. - you may want to read some economists books eg J K Galbraith "an affluent society"

    Posted 1 year ago #
37. 

    alaskan
    

    Novice
    Joined: Oct '11
    Posts: 7

    I have a civil engineering license and would say it's a very broad ranging and useful degree. Not sure if the degree was worth what I paid to get it from a top 10 school, but it allowed a 50k salary out of school and most people can be making 100k after 10 years and a license.

    Posted 1 year ago #
38. 

    FreeUrChains
    

    Apprentice
    Joined: Oct '11
    Posts: 50

    I am an EE stuck in the NuclearE world at a Nuclear Plant for now. I want out! It is so boring, never go into Nuclear! I rather work on robotics, lasers, remote sensing micro controllers or AI Programming; anything but power! Though it is the most lucrative and stable career an engineer can have, but I rather Live a life full of creativity than a life in maitaining procedures and safety! This is why i want ERE.

    Posted 1 year ago #

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